HUZZAH! Banned from Rentech.com!

[ZephyrZodiac]

I generally intend to type them but often I hit the ctrl key instead of the shift!  Bugs me, though, so I usually go back and put it right if I spot it!

[ElviraGoth]

I was amused by your little discussion of what part of England you were from and accents, since I moved to the southeastern part of the US from the midwest.  Midwesterners are notorious for having little or no accent.  However, where I moved to, the Southern dialect is so strong I had a hard time getting an "ear" for the accent.  I can remember going to a Hardees drive-up window and having a hard time understanding what the person taking my order was saying. 

It took me months to catch on to what some of the people at work were saying.  And, not to be sterotyping or anything, some of the black people here have a terrible slur added to the accent.  I remember walking past a room at work where a meeting was going on, and heard a black woman talk and I couldn't understand a word she said!  And I had been here about three or four years and was not having any trouble understanding most people.

Those of us who moved here from the midwest have made an extra effort NOT to pick up the accent.  But there are expressions here which amuse us, like "next Tuesday week"  which means a week from next Tuesday.  Or "cut on" the lights.  Cut off, maybe, but how do you cut something on?

So I sympathize with anyone trying to learn American English.  Learn it correctly, first and foremost.  Unfortunately, too many Americans don't. 

One thing that's big in this area is "boiled peanuts".  Disgusting stuff, but I suppose if you grew up with it...  Anyway, I see signs at roadside stands advertising "boled" peanuts, or "bowled", "bold", you get the idea.  That's how they pronounce it, so they think that's how it's spelled.  "Oil" is "ole" (like old without the d, not o-lay!), four is foe.  And I actually saw a commercial on TV for a "Wharhouse Sale" (warehouse).  Pathetic.  We have a game at work of finding bad spellings or grammer and reporting them to each other.

Just my 2 cents worth.

[reggikko]

I was amused by your little discussion of what part of England you were from and accents, since I moved to the southeastern part of the US from the midwest.  Midwesterners are notorious for having little or no accent.  However, where I moved to, the Southern dialect is so strong I had a hard time getting an "ear" for the accent.  I can remember going to a Hardees drive-up window and having a hard time understanding what the person taking my order was saying. 

My in-laws are Midwesterners and they have some speech "idiosyncracies". They pronounce Missouri Missour-uh, and an ice cream sundae is a sun-duh. They're from Illinois, just across from St Louis. Trust me, you have as much of an accent to those Southerners as they have to you. 

[Kitiara]

I was amused by your little discussion of what part of England you were from and accents, since I moved to the southeastern part of the US from the midwest.  Midwesterners are notorious for having little or no accent.  However, where I moved to, the Southern dialect is so strong I had a hard time getting an "ear" for the accent.  I can remember going to a Hardees drive-up window and having a hard time understanding what the person taking my order was saying. 

It took me months to catch on to what some of the people at work were saying.  And, not to be sterotyping or anything, some of the black people here have a terrible slur added to the accent.  I remember walking past a room at work where a meeting was going on, and heard a black woman talk and I couldn't understand a word she said!  And I had been here about three or four years and was not having any trouble understanding most people.

Those of us who moved here from the midwest have made an extra effort NOT to pick up the accent.  But there are expressions here which amuse us, like "next Tuesday week"  which means a week from next Tuesday.  Or "cut on" the lights.  Cut off, maybe, but how do you cut something on?

So I sympathize with anyone trying to learn American English.  Learn it correctly, first and foremost.  Unfortunately, too many Americans don't. 

One thing that's big in this area is "boiled peanuts".  Disgusting stuff, but I suppose if you grew up with it...  Anyway, I see signs at roadside stands advertising "boled" peanuts, or "bowled", "bold", you get the idea.  That's how they pronounce it, so they think that's how it's spelled.  "Oil" is "ole" (like old without the d, not o-lay!), four is foe.  And I actually saw a commercial on TV for a "Wharhouse Sale" (warehouse).  Pathetic.  We have a game at work of finding bad spellings or grammer and reporting them to each other.

Just my 2 cents worth.

Midwesterners do have an accent, you just don't hear it if you are from there. That is how accents work.

Oh, and where I am it's not so much 'bold' peanuts as 'boyld' (phonetically). You have to put the twang in. By the way, I agree. They are disgusting.


Reggikko - Did you have a problem with the previous post too?

[Spartan]

well im form CA so yeah

[ZephyrZodiac]

Actually, we say, "next Tuesday week" here in the UK, so it wouldn't sound odd to us!  What I find interesting is that a lot of expressions in current use in parts of the US were current in 18thC english but have died out here.  One that comes to mind is "I have been here these three weeks", which I believe is still used in some US regions.   

[Hook]

The English you hear on TV is "midwestern" and is considered unaccented.  I have no idea how people in the midwest actually talk.   For those who think midwestern is an "accent," do network newscasters have such a thick accent you can't understand them?   At least they don't have to have subtitles like some of the people in the stories they report on.

There's nothing wrong with ElviraGoth's post.  My mother and I moved to Texas from Pennsylvania when I was 7 and I had all the same problems.  And I *never* wanted to pick up that "horrible" accent!  Yeah, yeah.... eventually I did.

I married a Texas girl.  I was in the US Army stationed in Germany at the time.  When she flew to join me, she knew she'd have language problems in Germany, but when she had a layover at the airport in New York, she couldn't understand a thing people there said. 

After being away from Texas for a couple of years, I lost most of the accent.  The only time I had the accent was when I was very tired.  It was really interesting because when I was tired I could *hear* myself talking with an accent.

We've both lost our Texas accents over the years from living in other places, even though we've been back in Texas for over 20 years.  It was amusing to play an audio tape my wife had sent me before we were married, and compare her thick drawl then with her current speech (that was about 5 years after she left Texas).

Hook

[laeshanin]

Ah, the old misplaced apostrophe. It is the bane of my existence. The thing that gets me is that it isn't even one of the crazy rules of English. Plural? Yes? No apostrophe! Easy, right? It's bad enough when it's used on a sign that was handwritten for someone's garage sale. At the Palace Theater near my house, the sign on the custodian's door says "Janitor's Only". Doesn't someone check these things?

Mostly those that have no idea about possession or contraction, I think.

Interesting about the accents. I'm from the Midlands (UK) and have very little accent, according to the people I work/live with, but as someone pointed out, the minute you remove yourself from the local area someone will immediately point a finger and go "oooh, you're from Brum, aren't ya". Brummie accents are considered to be the most unattractive in the UK, even more so than Black Country (Dudley/Walsall, so called because of the industrialisation of the area, mining etc). I can, however do a very good West Country and Manc accent which confuses people. 

[ZephyrZodiac]

Well, Brummie may be considered unattractive, but at least most people can understand it!  And I've found that Brummies themselves are among the friendliest people in the UK, as goes for the Midlands generally.  Stand in a bus queue for an hour in London, and you're lucky if anyone talks to you, stand in one for five minutes in the Midlands and you can be chatting to a perfect stranger as if you've known them all your life!

[reggikko]

Reggikko - Did you have a problem with the previous post too?

First off, I'll admit I've been in a pissy mood lately. 

Secondly, as a Southerner, my hackles get raised sometimes when I feel like people are equating a southern accent with stupidity. I'm not saying that was Elvira's intent, but my pissyness took it that way. I guess it comes from years of Yankees coming down here and telling us what to do. We can be prideful and stubborn and sometimes we may lay the accent on even thicker just to flummox you. <wink>

[reggikko]

The English you hear on TV is "midwestern" and is considered unaccented.  I have no idea how people in the midwest actually talk.   For those who think midwestern is an "accent," do network newscasters have such a thick accent you can't understand them?   At least they don't have to have subtitles like some of the people in the stories they report on.

I've never heard Tom Brokaw say "warsh" or drop the 'to be' as in 'do you need spanked?', but I've heard it from my midwestern in-laws. Anchorpeople learn to speak free of any accent, and in standard English.

Don't make me haf' ta sic my dawg on y'all. 

[reggikko]

Actually, we say, "next Tuesday week" here in the UK, so it wouldn't sound odd to us!  What I find interesting is that a lot of expressions in current use in parts of the US were current in 18thC english but have died out here.  One that comes to mind is "I have been here these three weeks", which I believe is still used in some US regions.   

Very good point, Zephyr. I just recently learned that Cajun French differs so much from standard French because the Cajuns still speak a 17th century version. It's natural, if you think about it, that the language would evolve differently. A lot of the unique expressions/dialects in southern Louisiana have their roots in archaic French.

Down here, if someone says 'next Tuesday', they mean next Tuesday week, not necessarily the literal next Tuesday. That would be this Tuesday.

[Brynne]

I don't know what part of the south you guys are from, but where I'm from it's "bald peanuts". They're an acquired taste, and I have acquired. 
I moved to Atlanta back in 1980 at age 10, with a heavy New Jersey accent. I don't really have much of an accent at all now, but if I do, it's more southern in flavor. Atlanta doesn't really have a thick accent, anyway, because for the most part it's a melting pot. My dad's family is "quite" southern, and my mom's family is all from Chicago. And I can say that, yes, midwesterners have an accent. I can spot it right away.
I feel your frustration, Reg, of people equating southern-ness with stupidity. Every area of the world has its own form of redneck. Why pick on ours? 

[ZephyrZodiac]

My sister once visited friends in Ohio, back in the 70's, and she found it full of rednecks!  My niece now lives in New York (Brooklyn) and loves it!  I think a lot of what you find in a place depends on what you expect to find!

[breyerii]

Very good point, Zephyr. I just recently learned that Cajun French differs so much from standard French because the Cajuns still speak a 17th century version. It's natural, if you think about it, that the language would evolve differently. A lot of the unique expressions/dialects in southern Louisiana have their roots in archaic French.

Down here, if someone says 'next Tuesday', they mean next Tuesday week, not necessarily the literal next Tuesday. That would be this Tuesday.

This phenomenon works also with immigrants.

Years ago, when Italian-Americans returned to visit relatives, they discovered that they not only had learned their parents' dialect instead of the proper Italian they had thought - their dialect was also conservative, often difficult to understand at first.

[Liss]

I've never heard Tom Brokaw say "warsh" or drop the 'to be' as in 'do you need spanked?', but I've heard it from my midwestern in-laws. Anchorpeople learn to speak free of any accent, and in standard English.

Don't make me haf' ta sic my dawg on y'all. 

LOL I was just going to mention this...my grandma and grandpa always used to say "warsh" ... warsh the clothes, warsh the car....hehe

[ElviraGoth]

Ah, I see my last post was taken quite differently from the way I intended it to be.

No, I do not think southerners are stupid.  I do not equate a southern accent with stupidity in any way, shape or form.  And I grew up saying "warsh", but have since dropped that.

All I meant was that I had a problem understanding people, because I hadn't developed the "ear" I needed to understand the twang.  It's just this area has a little different accent.  I have no problem understanding the southern dialect as a whole.  And I did not have any problem understanding 99% of the people from this area.  I felt stupid, myself, when I had to ask someone to repeat what they said because my brain was not processing what they were saying into comprehensible words. 

I guy I met here once told me that yankees live up north, but damn yankees move to the south and stay!

I actually love the south, and most of the people here are great.  But I should also say that's true of where I'm from.  You have bad apples and stupidity everywhere!  Us midwesterners are not making fun of the people here any more or less than we did the people back home.  I should have also said that in my previous post.  We make fun of the idiots no matter where they're from.

And, believe me, we were made fun of by the locals when we moved down here, mostly because we did have a hard time understanding some of the people here.

And btw, we also say "crick" instead of "creek".  That's one of the things we make fun of about ourselves.  We do also point out our own idiot-syncracies.  We believe that if you can't take it, don't dish it out!  We jab each other about misspellings, using the wrong word or verb tense, all of it.

But the midwestern accent, as hook stated, is what anchor people on the news try to speak, because it has the least difficulty in being understood by the public as a whole.  I'm not saying my speech is perfect, by any means!

Have never heard "do you need spanked?", must be a regional thing like "warsh" and "crick".

I do, however, think that everyone needs to learn the correct way to spell the word they intend to use.  That's how I was brought up.  If you don't know how to spell it, LOOK IT UP!  Imagine trying to look up a word in the dictionary when you don't know how to spell it.  Makes a lot of sense, huh?  I heard that all the time I was growing up.

I apologize to you southerners if I offended you.  That was not my intention.  If it makes you feel better, one of the things I hear around here a lot is that Iowa stands for Idiots Out Walking Around.  When that's where you're from, it's real hard not to take offense at hearing that over and over. 

So rip off my lips if you must!  I can take it.

[Hook]

I've never heard Tom Brokaw say "warsh" or drop the 'to be' as in 'do you need spanked?', but I've heard it from my midwestern in-laws.

That's exactly how my mother talked.  She was born and raised in Pennsylvania.  Maybe we need to redefine "midwest."

Hook

[Inge]

I love that Boston accent!  Boarston; Dr Digoroarlami;  that "oar" sound for the 'o's.  That's my favourite American accent    I fell in love with it during the Louise Woodward trial.

[Shivani]

After being away from Texas for a couple of years, I lost most of the accent.  The only time I had the accent was when I was very tired.  It was really interesting because when I was tired I could *hear* myself talking with an accent.

I've noticed that myself. I grew up in Maine...Downeast Maine, to be specific, and anyone who's heard about Bert & I knows what I mean.  Though, having a mother from Sheffield and a father who spent a lot of time in different places and countries, I never had much of a regional accent.

However, the minute I get really tired, I and my husband can immediately hear where I came from.

[ElviraGoth]

Actually, I love all accents.  Used to try my best to imitate them as a child.  In fact, in high school, I was in the play "Mouse on the Moon" and got to play the character Terry Thomas played in the movie.  (Except that I was Miss Spender instead of Mr.)  I got the part because I could do the British accent!

I have to correct something I said earlier.  We didn't say "warsh", we said "woish".  Yes "oy", like oil.  My mom and I talked about that awhile back, and laughed about how that was how everyone talked around there!  (She now lives in Missouri, which, where I'm from, ends in the "ee" sound, not "uh".)

And it's funny, but since I grew up in Iowa, I never considered Pennsylvania or Ohio to be part of the Midwest.  They were always part of the eastern US to us.

And, no, Iowa is not the same as Ohio.  I hear that a lot, too.  (Mostly from the military people around here.  They seem to think it's funny every time, like they're the first person who's ever said it.)

As for spelling, one thing I have noticed on this board is that a lot of people have trouble with "there" (that place), "their" (belonging to them) and "they're" (contraction for "they are".)  And we expect people from other countries to get it right?  This is confusing to a lot of people in our own country!  I'm not critisizing, just pointing out how hard it is for people who grew up here and were taught this in school from an early age to get it right.  I know a lot of people who have a hard time with these, as well as other homophones.

[ZephyrZodiac]

I think you'd find those people from other countries who learned English in school will probably understand the difference between there, their and they're as they will have been taught the underlying grammar and syntax.  People who will have problems will be those who are mainly self-taught, and as such do not deserve to be criticised as they have at least tried....so many people today expect the host country to bend over backwards to accommodate them, but make no effort in return!

[breyerii]

I think you'd find those people from other countries who learned English in school will probably understand the difference between there, their and they're as they will have been taught the underlying grammar and syntax.  People who will have problems will be those who are mainly self-taught, and as such do not deserve to be criticised as they have at least tried....so many people today expect the host country to bend over backwards to accommodate them, but make no effort in return!

I'm sorry, ZZ, but I never, EVER studied English at school, yet I would never do such a mistake.

[ZephyrZodiac]

Then you must have taught yourself well!  Congratulations for being someone who did make an effort!

[breyerii]

Well, it's not that difficult, really. IF, and only IF, you learn English from books, the difference just stands out. This may sound paradoxical, but one can confuse those things much more easily if his/her knowledge of English stems mainly from conversation.

A textbook example for people learning English is three/tree/free - this will give you an idea of how deceptive spoken English can be...

EDIT: at least for an Italian, that is.