Maxoid Sam trusts the Feedback forms as little as we do?

[jrd]

EA has a bad repution for the way they treat their programmers (look up EA spouse), and QA departments. For EA QA apparently means ONLY check for global crashes and if routines exist, not if they necessarily work. Can you name a single recent EA game which did not require patches?

If EA had a real QA department which was allowed to do their job, they would have found the obvious bugs like the hair colour bug introduced by the Pets patch. Unfortunately the release date is all that matters, and QA seems to be an afterthougt.

[KellyQ]

Maxis is still a part of EA. The take-down of Maxis.com was temporary. Something even with LS said something along the lines of "made by Maxis for EA.."

Anyway, Maxoid Sam is supposed to be the one in charge of TS2 right now. He took over shortly before Pets released. When the transcript was edited (and I too saw it in the transcript to begin with, since I missed that chat) he was already in charge. It wouldn't have been edited without his knowing about it, and if it was, it's his JOB to find out about it. Just like it was his JOB to know the cheat was in there, in the first place.

Just like he doesn't know where the feedback forms disappear to? Hello, once again, he's the one in charge of the division, and he's trying to say he has no way of knowing what happens to them? They magically disappear just like the cheat magically appeared? Riiiggghhttt.

He also permabans people, and not the ones who need to be banned.  He does it if he just doesn't like what's being said.

This latest transcript for Seasons was already partially edited, and for something completely stupid. He came in and said "hello all" and didn't say "let's get chattin'"  I remember because I thought it was odd that they launched straight into the chat. He had it edited to make him look like less of a moron.

I wish they'd send him back to EA Sports. Tim was a moron, but he wasn't an asshole.

Ahh, I didn't realize that Maxis was still part of TS2, I thought they had been gobbled up by EA.

Also I have missed something despite reading these boards almost every day. What is this cheat that you are refering to and why was it denied it existed?

[notveryawesome]

I agree with Marvin Kosh. Having worked for large corporations in the past, I know firsthand how difficult (read: impossible) it is to get all of the different divisions within a company on the same page. Each team has its own way of doing things, and thinks that this is the *only* way to do them. Meanwhile, the other teams/departments are doing things their own way, and this is almost guaranteed to be completely different than the way that the other team(s) are doing things. Trying to get all of the teams to cooperate and, more importantly, COMMUNICATE is an exercise in frustration. The end result is that nothing gets done properly, wasting time, money, and resources in the process. Sound familiar?

[KatEnigma]

Ahh, I didn't realize that Maxis was still part of TS2, I thought they had been gobbled up by EA.

Also I have missed something despite reading these boards almost every day. What is this cheat that you are refering to and why was it denied it existed?

During one of the chats, a Maxoid promised us that there would be a new cheat in Pets that allowed us to increase the number of Sims on a lot.  Then the guide came out, with no mention of it, followed by the game, with no mention of it anywhere either. So someone else asked about it on the BBS, and I backed her up, saying that I remembered it too, and swore it was in one of the chats. MaxoidSam said no, he'd asked around, it didn't exist and we were never told that, it wasn't in the transcript- we must have imagined it or read it somewhere else- sorry we were disappointed. I'd remembered telling kellinjar about it after reading the transcript via IM, so I looked up my IM history, and sure enough, the date I told him was the same day as the chat, a couple hours later. I posted about this odd coincidence *cough*, and MaxoidSam got all irate about it, guaranteeing that no one ever edited the transcript, and basically how dare I suggest such a thing.  I let it drop, but a couple days later, one of the usual people who poke around inside the game, discovered three cheats to adjust the total of Sims per lot, and the division of Pets and Humans within that total. There was no response to my suggestion in the BBS thread that I must have imagined them into everyone's game, then. 

[KellyQ]

How very 1984 .

Thanks for clearing up the mystery for me.

[Moa]

EA has a bad repution for the way they treat their programmers (look up EA spouse), and QA departments. For EA QA apparently means ONLY check for global crashes and if routines exist, not if they necessarily work. Can you name a single recent EA game which did not require patches?

If EA had a real QA department which was allowed to do their job, they would have found the obvious bugs like the hair colour bug introduced by the Pets patch. Unfortunately the release date is all that matters, and QA seems to be an afterthougt.

Honestly, can anybody here point me to a recent computer game that didn't require patches? In the past year I've played both Oblivion and Neverwinter Nights, both of which had at least one patch issued for them, and both of which have forums filled with disgruntled players complaining about various bugs and/or game design decisions. I probably would have bought Gothic 3 if it weren't for the reviews commenting on how the varous bugs made the game almost unplayable on various rigs. Granted, I'm not a big PC gamer, but any new game release for the PC seems guaranteed to contain a certain degree of bugginess. For the Sims, and the other games I've played this year, the overall gaming experience was positive for me, despite the various bugs. If the aggravation of the bugs exceeds the pleasure I get from the game, I stop playing the game.

I would think that extensively beta testing the Sims would be problematic, given the number of optional expansion packs and the variety of computer setups. The worst bug I've had to cope with is the Nvidia OFB crashes, but there are a lot of Nvidia card users who had no BSOD crashes. I hope EA/Nvidia comes up with a working solution to this that doesn't entail turning down my graphics, but it's not something I would have expected them to have caught prior to releasing the game.

I do think EA could stand to pay more attention to cleaning up the various bugs and problems after releasing an expansion pack. We can get decent fixes within a reasonable amount of time on the MATY forum, doesn't seem like it should be too much of a stretch for a company like EA to commit to clean and tighten the game code on an ongoing basis.

[dizzy]

I used to think that way, but it's been over 30 months since the initial release and there are still critical bugs in *that* code. It's not for a lack of reporting them that they haven't been fixed, nor can they use the excuse that it's because of incapable testers or coders or that they aren't motivated.

In the same amount of time, by way of example, the Linux kernel has gone through 8 major revisions, fixing thousands of bugs, implementing support for hundreds of devices as well as kernel-based virtual environments, and is a far more complex set of code to boot.

[Metalkatt]

How do you get a picture of a game crash?  My game likes to freeze and hourglass, and then crash while whining bout there not being a dirextx9-compatible graphic device (which is bullshit because I have DX10 and upgraded my vidcard).  I can't exactly snap a photo of it when it's frozen.  *head-shake*  Idiots.  And, of course they can't replicate it, because they have ultraswish machines and assuredly not the same specs.  Besides, when the only answer one gets is "take your hacks out and don't touch woolprop," one gets a little disgusted... Especially when the same damn thing happens in a hack-free game.

[witch]

...and is a far more complex set of code to boot.

So to speak.

[KatEnigma]

Linux is also Open Source, and has a lot more people working on it than TS2 does, both paid and volunteer. It can hardly be judged by the same standard.

[jrd]

EA has a bad repution for the way they treat their programmers (look up EA spouse), and QA departments. For EA QA apparently means ONLY check for global crashes and if routines exist, not if they necessarily work. Can you name a single recent EA game which did not require patches?

If EA had a real QA department which was allowed to do their job, they would have found the obvious bugs like the hair colour bug introduced by the Pets patch. Unfortunately the release date is all that matters, and QA seems to be an afterthougt.

Honestly, can anybody here point me to a recent computer game that didn't require patches?

I should have said, "release day patches to make an unplayable game, playable". I am all for patches being released of course, but if the gold master is an incomplete and buggy product which requires an often substantial download to even make playable, I am annoyed.
The gold master of a game should be a finished product, meaning that it should have at least all obvious bugs fixed. Not so often with EA: they release based on preplanned shipping dates, regardless of game state.

[jrd]

How do you get a picture of a game crash?  My game likes to freeze and hourglass, and then crash while whining bout there not being a dirextx9-compatible graphic device (which is bullshit because I have DX10 and upgraded my vidcard). 

Vista problem. Vista currently does not have a really working DirectX 9 emulation yet, so you tend to run into stuff like this.
How to get a picture? Camera.

[V]

What about using "print screen"? or did Vista break that, too?

[jrd]

If your system is locked up, I think you'll find that print screen is not exactly helpful. The clipboard is memory only, thus wiped on reboot. Even if the system could respond to it.

[KatEnigma]

If your system is locked up, I think you'll find that print screen is not exactly helpful. The clipboard is memory only, thus wiped on reboot. Even if the system could respond to it.

Yes, and on the rare occasions when I crash, it's not just the game that goes, it does lock up the whole system.

As for bugs, in order to capture them, you have to know they are coming. Unless you can create the same error every time, this is a wee bit hard.  Plus, how do you take a screenshot/picture of, say, the jump bug? Unless you're doing video capture 100% of the time when you play, his suggestion is nonsense. All it can possibly help them fix are the tiny things they've been fixing all along. 

[Assmitten]

Ahh, I didn't realize that Maxis was still part of TS2, I thought they had been gobbled up by EA.

Also I have missed something despite reading these boards almost every day. What is this cheat that you are refering to and why was it denied it existed?

During one of the chats, a Maxoid promised us that there would be a new cheat in Pets that allowed us to increase the number of Sims on a lot.  Then the guide came out, with no mention of it, followed by the game, with no mention of it anywhere either. So someone else asked about it on the BBS, and I backed her up, saying that I remembered it too, and swore it was in one of the chats. MaxoidSam said no, he'd asked around, it didn't exist and we were never told that, it wasn't in the transcript- we must have imagined it or read it somewhere else- sorry we were disappointed. I'd remembered telling kellinjar about it after reading the transcript via IM, so I looked up my IM history, and sure enough, the date I told him was the same day as the chat, a couple hours later. I posted about this odd coincidence *cough*, and MaxoidSam got all irate about it, guaranteeing that no one ever edited the transcript, and basically how dare I suggest such a thing.  I let it drop, but a couple days later, one of the usual people who poke around inside the game, discovered three cheats to adjust the total of Sims per lot, and the division of Pets and Humans within that total. There was no response to my suggestion in the BBS thread that I must have imagined them into everyone's game, then. 

This is interesting and dumb. I'm not trying to nitpick, I'm just curious...is it possible that he just doesn't know what the fuck is going on? It seems like a lot of work to cover it up. I ask because my bf works for a giant software company and he's surrounded by people who don't really know wtf technically, and other people sort of carry them. They will talk out of their asses in this fashion at any given moment, and it's not a conspiraracy, it's an attempt tp preserve their status.

Is it possible to go over Yosemite Sam's head? Why deal with the inept?

[gjam]

Is it possible to go over Yosemite Sam's head? Why deal with the inept?

It might be more to the point to go under him.  He's sounding like the kind of manager who thinks he doesn't need to understand the technical bits because he has people for that.

[Metalkatt]

How do you get a picture of a game crash?  My game likes to freeze and hourglass, and then crash while whining bout there not being a dirextx9-compatible graphic device (which is bullshit because I have DX10 and upgraded my vidcard).

Vista problem. Vista currently does not have a really working DirectX 9 emulation yet, so you tend to run into stuff like this.
How to get a picture? Camera.

Ahh, but I don't have Vista, I have XP.  (Nor do I have a camera.)

If your system is locked up, I think you'll find that print screen is not exactly helpful. The clipboard is memory only, thus wiped on reboot. Even if the system could respond to it.

Yes, and on the rare occasions when I crash, it's not just the game that goes, it does lock up the whole system.

Yes, exactly!  Can never tell which one of the slowdowns is going to do it, either.

[KatEnigma]

How do you get a picture of a game crash?  My game likes to freeze and hourglass, and then crash while whining bout there not being a dirextx9-compatible graphic device (which is bullshit because I have DX10 and upgraded my vidcard).

Vista problem. Vista currently does not have a really working DirectX 9 emulation yet, so you tend to run into stuff like this.
How to get a picture? Camera.


Ahh, but I don't have Vista, I have XP.  (Nor do I have a camera.)

The only stable Nvidia drivers for TS2 are way too old to work for your card, even assuming there are DX10  card drivers that are at all stable, period.  For TS2, you really need to run on ATI cards if you want to avoid some of these headaches. Nvidia doesn't seem interested in fixing the problem and I don't think EA is capable of fixing it.

As for MaxoidSam being merely incompetent, rather than a liar- if he'd just not known about the cheat, then okay. But saying that the transcript hadn't been edited, when it clearly had as based on electronic evidence? The same way he claims he doesn't know hooooowww that feedback form disappears? That goes beyond incompetent and into slimy.

[miramis]

My own card is running TS2 awesomely now with the nvidia drivers, but I have a gx2 so the latest drivers fully support it.  Just wanted to throw that in there because it's been seeming to me over the last year or so that Nvidia's drivers are getting less and less backward compatible with the older cards, possibly to force people into upgrading to the higher priced ones.

It's possible they mean for the type of bugs and glitches that can be captured with snapshots/screenies and video, stuff like the lighting suddenly going fubar and making whole areas blacker than black, that sort of thing.  Some people have a real problem with des ribing problems, I think this is a good thing giving us the ability to show them what we are trying to tell them.   Of course many issues can't be recorded like that. 

Maxoid Sam also made a post in the pets section in someones thread, and it was about fish.  Now here is what I can't get my head around.  I had a GeForce FX 5600 video card, and I was always able to see the fish, until a certain expansion or patch came out, at which point, like many others the fish became invisible. 

Now in his post a week or so ago, he added the list of compatible video cards that would support seeing the fish, the GeForce 5600 was there, I looked specifically for it out of curiosity.  Later he came back and edited a number of those cards out. including my old one, saying they weren't supported.  How does it go about that a video card that was supporting the dang fish, suddenly stops with a new EP, and it's the hardwares fault?

When you mentioned perma-bans there, I thought for a moment that Twain had bought the farm, but no, I see he's still alive and kicking thank goodness.  Isn't 'Search' wonderful.

[KatEnigma]

I hadn't really been back to the BBS since that run in with MaxoidSam, so apparently I missed vibrateforyou being banned for 2 weeks without warning for sharing info from the Prima guide for Pets, after being given express permission to do so as long as she paraphrased, rather than directly plagiarizing. The subject came up today in a thread about the Seasons guide being delayed by EB/Gamestop. They banned her and wouldn't even tell her why when she tried to get it out of them.  She said she hadn't been back much since, the same as me.

Needless to say, when I get my guide, I guess the only info sharing I do will be from the relative safety of RetardoLand and Malaysia.  And maybe wake up Simtelligence by leading the sheep there, not here.  Somehow, I'm pretty sure kellinjar would tell EA and Prima where they could stick it, too. 

[miramis]

That's a stupid thing to ban someone over, I guess that elevates him from moron to Dickhead then.  People have been posting from the Prima Guide ever since TS2's release, it was something that bound the community together, and they had to go and ruin it for everyone.

[ZiggyDoodle]

People have been posting from the Prima Guide ever since TS2's release, it was something that bound the community together, and they had to go and ruin it for everyone.

Could be that the publisher/author howled and made threats of copyright litigation if EA allowed the copyright violations to continue.

[J. M. Pescado]

Could be that the publisher/author howled and made threats of copyright litigation if EA allowed the copyright violations to continue.

Wouldn't work, anyway, quoting passages out of a book is considered to be "fair use".

[Assmitten]

One thing I have discovered as a librarian is that very, very few people actually understand what fair use means. It's a shame, too, because there are some cheap and easy books on the subject. I think most people would rather not even skirt the issue. People seem to like complete avoidance of trouble over a little research.