Building/Upgrading a PC for TS2

[brat]

Please tell me what you think of this as I am not the sharpest knife in the drawer when it comes to all this technical crap. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.

  XPS 410  Qty     1   
  Intel ® Core™2 Duo Processor E6700 (2.66GHz, 1066 FSB), Genuine Windows® XP Media Center 2005 Edition with re-installation CD Unit Price     
 

XPS 410 Intel ® Core™2 Duo Processor E6700 (2.66GHz, 1066 FSB)
Operating System Genuine Windows® XP Media Center 2005 Edition with re-installation CD
Memory 4GB Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM at 533MHz- 2DIMMs

Monitor 19 inch E196FP Analog Flat Panel
Video Card 256MB nVidia GeForce 7900 GS
Hard Drive DataSafe 250GB (Includes main hard drive plus a hidden reserve hard drive)
Floppy Drive and Media Reader 13 in 1 Media Card Reader and 3.5 in Floppy Drive

CD or DVD Drive Dual Drives: 16x DVD-ROM Drive + 16x DVD+/-RW w/ dbl layer write capable
Sound Cards Integrated Sound Blaster®Audigy™ HD Software Edition

Future Operating Systems Windows Vista™ Capable
Physics Accelerator AGEIA® PhysX® physics accelerator

 
 

[jsalemi]

I've been thinking of upgrading the ATI Radeon X300SE (128MB PCI Express x16)  that came with my Dell 8400 (Pentium 4, 3.2GHz and 2GB SDRAM).
...
Anyone out there using and liking one of the higher end Radeon cards enough to suggest it?

I have the same system, and I replaced the X300 with a X700 Pro about 6 months ago, and it works fine -- I can play with all settings high with little or no lag on all but the biggest and/or most populated lots.  The X700's are hard to find these days, but I believe the 8400 can drive a X1300 with no problem. If you can find an X800/850, that should give you a good enough boost for the game (which I see Hegelian has already told you ).

[SpaceDoll]

Right now the game freezes for a minute or two during the change clothes spin if I have more than 2 sims on a lot; this is presumably processor slowness, right?  I am getting a new video card and some RAM just to up the graphics settings from low so I can enjoy the game a little more for the next few months, until I get a new computer.  After that, I'll probably give the new card to my little sister.  That's why I'm looking in the $50 range; I only need it for about 4 months.  Then I'm going to build my own system, or at least give it a shot!  I'll definately be checking out this thread again then!  So the 9600 it is!  Thanks for all the help.

[KittKitt]

Right now the game freezes for a minute or two during the change clothes spin if I have more than 2 sims on a lot; this is presumably processor slowness, right?  I am getting a new video card and some RAM just to up the graphics settings from low so I can enjoy the game a little more for the next few months, until I get a new computer.  After that, I'll probably give the new card to my little sister.  That's why I'm looking in the $50 range; I only need it for about 4 months.  Then I'm going to build my own system, or at least give it a shot!  I'll definately be checking out this thread again then!  So the 9600 it is!  Thanks for all the help.

Typically, I'd say most of those little pauses would be more likely your memory (and possibly your hard drive) than anything.  When you do something and the game just freezes for a moment, that usually means it's loading something.  In this case, the graphics for your new outfit. 

Certainly a faster processor won't hurt, but with the information I have to go on at this point, I'd tend to think that more memory would be a better way to go, and if you've got a really old and slow hard drive, that again could be a big part of it since everything you do in windows will usually make use of cache memory that it writes/reads on the drive -particularly if you've got low system RAM to begin with.

-Kitt

[Hegelian]

Please tell me what you think of this as I am not the sharpest knife in the drawer when it comes to all this technical crap. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.

  XPS 410  Qty     1   
  Intel ® Core™2 Duo Processor E6700 (2.66GHz, 1066 FSB), Genuine Windows® XP Media Center 2005 Edition with re-installation CD

If you can afford it, it's certainly enough and more to play TS2 with all settings maxed. The AGEIA physics accelerator is a waste of money unless you plan to be buying the newest first-person shooters coming out in the next couple years (and even then it may not be worth it); it will do precisely zero for your TS2 game. Four Gigs of RAM is also pretty much a waste—2 GB is plenty. Ditch the AGEIA and the extra 2 GB of RAM and get a faster CPU instead. And get XP Pro instead of Media Center if you can. 

Okay, I've looked at the XPS 410 on Dell's Web site. I would spec the Productivity model rather than the media model. The E6700 is the fastest Core 2 CPU you can get with this machine, so that's settled. Get the 667 MHz RAM rather than the 533 MHz, 2 GB. No AGEIA accelerator. The hard drive is your choice, but the 500 GB SATA 3 drive is probably faster than whatever they use for the DataSafe setup. Personally, I'd skip DataSafe and just get a second hard drive from Newegg and store my data on that (plus you can put your main paging file there, improving overall Windows performance). If you want easy file backup, get one of those 120 GB external USB hard drives that comes with back-up software. And XP Pro.

Can't tell you anything about the monitor, other than to run it at its native resolution (probably 1280 x 1024) even though stuff on the screen will look too small until you get accustomed to it. If you're not willing to do that, skip the monitor and try to find a decent CRT from an online-retailer—that way you can run at any resolution you like, and games look better on CRTs anyway. Something like the NEC FE992 (19-inch) or AS120 (21-inch), ViewSonic G225fb (21-inch), or Samsung 1100MB (21-inch).

[brat]

That's exactly the kind of information I needed. Thanks so much for your help.

[twistingsims]

Hi, its me again! lol   So my hard drive died, got a new one and decided to upgrade my video card.  Got everything reinstalled, Sims2 right up to the Glamour pack, but not including FFS.

Went into the game, everything is sloooooww motion!! Help!!  I'm sure I must have to tweak something in the ATI control centre, or something.  Ran the "Can you run this game" and here are the results . . .

CPU  Minimum: Pentium III or Athlon
 . . . . . . . . . . You Have: AMD Athlon(tm) XP 1700+ .......................PASS

CPU Speed . . . .Minimum: 800 mhz with a T&L capable Video Card (2.0 Ghz without Hardware T&L Video Card)
 . . . . . . . . . . . You Have: 1.46 GHz Performance Rated at 1.70 GHz . . . . . . . . . . . PASS

System RAM . . .Minimum: 256 MB
. . . . . . . . . . . .You Have: 639.5 MB . . . . . . PASS

Operating System . . . . . Minimum: Windows 98/ME/2000/XP (95 & NT not supported)
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .You Have: Microsoft Windows XP Professional (Build 2600) . . . . . . . . . . PASS

Video Card . . . . . Minimum: 32 MB 3D accelerated video card (NVIDIA GeForce2/ATI Radeon VE/Intel Extreme Graphics or better)
. . . . . . . . . . . You Have: Radeon X1600 Series (Radeon X1600 Series AGP (0x71C2)) . . . . . . . . .PASS
   
Video Card Features - Minimum attributes of your Video Card
   
Video RAM: Required - 32 MB , You have - 512.0 MB
Video Card 3D Acceleration: Required - Yes , You have - Yes
Video HW Rasterization: Required - no , You have - Yes
Video HW Transform & Lighting: Required - no , You have - Yes
   
Video Card Driver Version (DirectX)
Your driver version number is: 6.14.10.6631
. . . . . FYI: Make sure you have the latest driver for your video card. Click 'Free Driver Update' and we'll direct you to your video card manufacturer.   

Sound Card . . . . . Minimum: Yes
 . . . . . . . . . . . . . You Have: VIA AC'97 Audio Controller (WDM) . . . . . . . . PASS

Sound Card Driver Version . . . . . Your driver version number is: 5.1.2535.0

FYI: Your sound card driver version is provided for your information, but it is not part of this analysis. But proper sound card driver versions are important to the proper operation of your product.   

Free Disk Space . . . . . Minimum: 3.5 GB
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . You Have: 18.4 GB . . . . . . PASS

I did update the driver for the video card.  Also, should I change the color quality from 16 bits to 32 bits?  You're help will be greatly appreciated!!

[J. M. Pescado]

And get XP Pro instead of Media Center if you can. 

Don't "get" Windoze. It is not worth paying money for. You already have it anyway, so just go with "no OS". You're going to have to nuke and reinstall to cleanse the computer of factory-installed spyware anyway.

[witch]

And get XP Pro instead of Media Center if you can. 

Don't "get" Windoze. It is not worth paying money for. You already have it anyway, so just go with "no OS". You're going to have to nuke and reinstall to cleanse the computer of factory-installed spyware anyway.

I honest-to-god saw over a dozen icons in the system tray of some poor bugger's brand new laptop. No wonder the machines get faster and faster, they're carrying a huge load of resource hungry crap they try to hide in the background. Windoze included, with it's payload of services - including the ones that allow people to pop in and run your PC.

[J. M. Pescado]

And you wonder why I say you should nuke any preinstalled system with your own install-overs.

[DrBeast]

twistingsims: do you notice any slowdown or such in any other game and/or application or is you problem strictly Sims-related?

BTW, maybe you should post this on a thread of its own, in the "Oops! You Broke It!" section.

[ZiggyDoodle]

I honest-to-god saw over a dozen icons in the system tray of some poor bugger's brand new laptop. No wonder the machines get faster and faster, they're carrying a huge load of resource hungry crap they try to hide in the background.

I blame the computer mfgs for that. When I purchased my last Dell I tried to have some say in what would be installed - no go.

After I set up the system, I spent an hour dumping the crap, such as AOL (the biggest bugger of them all), Earthlink, and other garbage. 

My next system will be custom built.

[Hegelian]

Went into the game, everything is sloooooww motion!! Help!!  I'm sure I must have to tweak something in the ATI control centre, or something.  Ran the "Can you run this game" and here are the results . . .

I did update the driver for the video card.  Also, should I change the color quality from 16 bits to 32 bits?  You're help will be greatly appreciated!!

Yes, you should set the graphics to 32-bit color. You can also try reducing the various settings in the game's graphics controls. Beyond that, the Athlon XP 1700+ is pretty slow by current standards. Those have been off the market for some time, so finding an upgrade will be difficult. If it is a Socket A CPU, you may be able to use one of the current Socket A Semprons, but you will need to check with the motherboard manufacturer to find out whether the board will support the "Thoroughbred" Semprons. As of June 2002, there was an Athlon XP 1700+ as part of the Thoroughbred line (earlier models used the "Palomino" core), so it is possible your motherboard will support CPUs with the Thoroughbred core. If you can use one of these Semprons, the 2800+ is $75 at Newegg.

[twistingsims]

twistingsims: do you notice any slowdown or such in any other game and/or application or is you problem strictly Sims-related?

BTW, maybe you should post this on a thread of its own, in the "Oops! You Broke It!" section.

Sorry about posting in the wrong place, but I wanted to know if this graphic card is too much for my processor and if I get a lower end graphic card, would that solve the problem.

Sims2 seems to be the only game that is doing the slow motion thing, its not lagging or choppy, just all slow motion! I've tried changing all the settings in the game, but makes no difference.  Also tried changing settings in the ATI control centre, but that hasn't changed the slow motion of the game.

[Hegelian]

Sorry about posting in the wrong place, but I wanted to know if this graphic card is too much for my processor and if I get a lower end graphic card, would that solve the problem.

Well, no. The graphics processor will just wait for the CPU to feed it data. Have you checked to see if the CPU is running at its proper speed? You can use cpu-z to see the CPU speed--do a Google search. 

OTOH, it may be possible that your power supply isn't adequate for the X1600, although this does not appear to be a demanding board compared to what is currently available. I don't know whether insufficient power to the graphics board would slow down the game, though.

[Weaver]

I have the same card (poor aged AGP ) with 256MB and tend to get choppy graphics because of driver conflicts.
The resolution usually involves uninstalling, rebooting, installing, rebooting, checking, uninstalling, rebooting - you get the picture.

[twistingsims]

Well I don't think its the graphic card.  I uninstalled the new one, and reinstalled the old one and after uninstalling the whole game and reinstalling just the Sims2, the slow motion is still happening.

I have installed a couple other games and there is no slow motion going on with those ones.  The are not as graphic intensive of course, but still they worked fine.

I also have Sims Online installed and I was able to play that game with no problems.  I just wonder if it has anything to do with me installing Windows XP Pro as my operating system?  I did it myself, partitioned the hard drives myself and such, but I didn't see any glitches along the way.  I just don't know what else to try.   

I did the CPU-z program and the results are as follows:

Core Speed  . . . . . . . . .1460.5 MHz
Mulitplier  . . . . . . . . . . . x11.0
Bus Speed . . . . . . . . . . 132.8 MHz
Rated FSB  . . . . . . . . . . 265.5 MHz
L1 Data . . . . . . . . . . . . 64 KB
L1 Code  . . . . . . . . . . . 64 KB
Level 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . 256 KB

[Weaver]

Do you have any other games that can be considered equal or greater graphic intensity compared to The Sims 2?
If you can identify the problem is specifically with the game - a saved games backup and clean re-install is a reasonable solution.

There used to be a site I used called PC Pitstop which allows performance tests, diagnosis and reports.
I'm not sure to advocate it as my experience was a few years back and the site has changed since.

[twistingsims]

Thank you Weaver, 

I did do a complete uninstall of all my sims2 games, and a clean reinstall of just the core game, but no difference, still the slow motion.

I do have Sims1 games, but I don't know if you would consider that high graphics or not?

[Weaver]

Did you store/move your saved games (My Documents/EA Games/The Sims2) and load a fresh game after the reinstall?
There could be a misplaced setting in a configuration file causing the motion problems.

I would consider Sims 1 a less demanding game (based on the minimum/required specifications and earlier release date).
If this is related to a hardware issue, it is odd that it occurs with solely The Sims 2 unless the game is too demanding on resources.

[twistingsims]

Yup, its a fresh game, no downloads, no saved games at all.  I just can't believe this is happening. If it was the graphics card, it should have played the game normally when I reinstalled my old graphic card, but it didn't, the exact same slow motion thing is still happening.  I have experienced lag before in my games, as well as choppy play, especially as the neighborhoods grew, but this is in no way the same thing, just all slow motion, even with all settings set to the lowest.

[jsalemi]

Hmm, is it possible something you installed put the wrong version of DirectX in?  Maybe backed it down to 8 instead of 9c? 

[Hegelian]

If I am not mistaken, first Sims game was not a 3D game at all, so it wouldn't be any challenge for the X1600. It probably wasn't a challenge for the Althon XP, either.You don't say what your previous graphics board was, but since you've done a clean install of the OS, that wouldn't matter (if you had just swapped boards and the old one was based on an nVidia GPU, there could be a conflict with remaining bits of the nVidia driver set).

My feeling is that the CPU is the problem, since TS2 performance depends primarily on CPU power. Also, have you installed the drivers for your motherboard chipset? If you are using the generic drivers included with WinXP, that might possibly be the source of the problem (although I'm not taking bets).

Since you have an Athlon CPU, you probably have a VIA chipset (although there are others—cpu-z can tell you this). You can download unified driver packs ("Hyperion") for VIA chipsets from VIA's Web site. The driver pack should include an AGP driver for the motherboard (but of course you install the entire driver set for your chipset).

[DrBeast]

I think there was a cheat for controlling motion speed...

*digs into his archive*

Got it!
Properly called Slowmotion, heh.
Here's a test: when you're in a lot, press Control+Shift+C to bring up the game console, then type "Slowmotion 0" without the quotes, then press Enter. If motion returns to normal, you probably have a hack or maybe a userstartup.cheat file that somehow snuck in and refused to go when you did the spring cleaning (uninstall, reinstall). Quite a long shot, but you've stated more than once that it's not the graphics that are stuttering, it's

the exact same slow motion thing is still happening.  I have experienced lag before in my games, as well as choppy play, especially as the neighborhoods grew, but this is in no way the same thing, just all slow motion, even with all settings set to the lowest.

[twistingsims]

I have provided the below from my DxDiag Module:

------------------
System Information
------------------
Time of this report: 9/19/2006, 15:40:52
       Machine name: LAURA-ZMVSCO80S
   Operating System: Windows XP Professional (5.1, Build 2600) (2600.xpclient.010817-1148)
           Language: English (Regional Setting: English)
System Manufacturer: MICRO-STAR INTERNATIONAL CO., LTD
       System Model: MS-6330
               BIOS: Award Modular BIOS v6.00PG
          Processor: AMD Athlon(tm) XP 1700+, ~1.5GHz
             Memory: 640MB RAM
          Page File: 150MB used, 1412MB available
        Windows Dir: C:\WINDOWS
    DirectX Version: DirectX 9.0c (4.09.0000.0904)
DX Setup Parameters: Not found
     DxDiag Version: 5.03.0001.0904 32bit Unicode

------------
DxDiag Notes
------------
  DirectX Files Tab: No problems found.
      Display Tab 1: No problems found.
        Sound Tab 1: No problems found.
          Music Tab: No problems found.
          Input Tab: No problems found.
        Network Tab: No problems found.

--------------------
DirectX Debug Levels
--------------------
Direct3D:    0/4 (n/a)
DirectDraw:  0/4 (retail)
DirectInput: 0/5 (n/a)
DirectMusic: 0/5 (n/a)
DirectPlay:  0/9 (retail)
DirectSound: 0/5 (retail)
DirectShow:  0/6 (retail)

---------------
Display Devices
---------------
        Card name: Radeon X1600 Series
     Manufacturer: ATI Technologies Inc.
        Chip type: Radeon X1600 Series AGP (0x71C2)
         DAC type: Internal DAC(400MHz)
       Device Key: Enum\PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_71C2&SUBSYS_0850174B&REV_00
   Display Memory: 512.0 MB
     Current Mode: 1024 x 768 (32 bit) (75Hz)
          Monitor: Plug and Play Monitor
  Monitor Max Res: 1600,1200
      Driver Name: ati2dvag.dll
   Driver Version: 6.14.0010.6631 (English)
      DDI Version: 9 (or higher)
Driver Attributes: Final Retail
 Driver Date/Size: 8/2/2006 19:08:06, 258048 bytes
      WHQL Logo'd: Yes
  WHQL Date Stamp: n/a
              VDD: n/a
         Mini VDD: ati2mtag.sys
    Mini VDD Date: 8/2/2006 19:07:51, 1681920 bytes
Device Identifier: {D7B71EE2-3282-11CF-1C6D-5A28A1C2CB35}
        Vendor ID: 0x1002
        Device ID: 0x71C2
        SubSys ID: 0x0850174B
      Revision ID: 0x0000
      Revision ID: 0x0000
      Video Accel: ModeMPEG2_C ModeMPEG2_D ModeWMV8_B ModeWMV8_A ModeWMV9_B ModeWMV9_A
 Deinterlace Caps: {6E8329FF-B642-418B-BCF0-BCB6591E255F}: Format(In/Out)=(YUY2,YUY2)

Frames(Prev/Fwd/Back)=(0,0,1) Caps=VideoProcess_YUV2RGB VideoProcess_StretchX

VideoProcess_StretchY DeinterlaceTech_PixelAdaptive
                   {335AA36E-7884-43A4-9C91-7F87FAF3E37E}: Format(In/Out)=(YUY2,YUY2)

Frames(Prev/Fwd/Back)=(0,0,0) Caps=VideoProcess_YUV2RGB VideoProcess_StretchX

VideoProcess_StretchY DeinterlaceTech_BOBVerticalStretch
                   {3C5323C1-6FB7-44F5-9081-056BF2EE449D}: Format(In/Out)=(NV12,0x3231564e)

Frames(Prev/Fwd/Back)=(0,0,2) Caps=VideoProcess_YUV2RGB VideoProcess_StretchX

VideoProcess_StretchY DeinterlaceTech_PixelAdaptive
                   {552C0DAD-CCBC-420B-83C8-74943CF9F1A6}: Format(In/Out)=(NV12,0x3231564e)

Frames(Prev/Fwd/Back)=(0,0,2) Caps=VideoProcess_YUV2RGB VideoProcess_StretchX

VideoProcess_StretchY DeinterlaceTech_PixelAdaptive
                   {6E8329FF-B642-418B-BCF0-BCB6591E255F}: Format(In/Out)=(NV12,0x3231564e)

Frames(Prev/Fwd/Back)=(0,0,1) Caps=VideoProcess_YUV2RGB VideoProcess_StretchX

VideoProcess_StretchY DeinterlaceTech_PixelAdaptive
                   {335AA36E-7884-43A4-9C91-7F87FAF3E37E}: Format(In/Out)=(NV12,0x3231564e)

Frames(Prev/Fwd/Back)=(0,0,0) Caps=VideoProcess_YUV2RGB VideoProcess_StretchX

VideoProcess_StretchY DeinterlaceTech_BOBVerticalStretch
         Registry: OK
     DDraw Status: Enabled
       D3D Status: Enabled
       AGP Status: Enabled
DDraw Test Result: Not run
 D3D7 Test Result: Not run
 D3D8 Test Result: Not run
 D3D9 Test Result: Not run  (PS I have run these tests, all look good)

-------------
Sound Devices
-------------
            Description: VIA Audio (WAVE)
 Default Sound Playback: Yes
 Default Voice Playback: Yes
            Hardware ID: PCI\VEN_1106&DEV_3058&SUBSYS_33001462&REV_50
        Manufacturer ID: 1
             Product ID: 100
                   Type: WDM
            Driver Name: ac97via.sys
         Driver Version: 5.10.0000.3521 (English)
      Driver Attributes: Final Retail
            WHQL Logo'd: Yes
          Date and Size: 8/17/2001 09:20:16, 35200 bytes
            Other Files:
        Driver Provider: Microsoft
         HW Accel Level: Full
              Cap Flags: 0xF5F
    Min/Max Sample Rate: 44100, 48000
Static/Strm HW Mix Bufs: 1, 0
 Static/Strm HW 3D Bufs: 0, 0
              HW Memory: 0
       Voice Management: No
 EAX(tm) 2.0 Listen/Src: No, No
   I3DL2(tm) Listen/Src: No, No
Sensaura(tm) ZoomFX(tm): No
               Registry: OK
      Sound Test Result: Not run

---------------------
Sound Capture Devices
---------------------
            Description: VIA Audio (WAVE)
  Default Sound Capture: Yes
  Default Voice Capture: Yes
            Driver Name: ac97via.sys
         Driver Version: 5.10.0000.3521 (English)
      Driver Attributes: Final Retail
          Date and Size: 8/17/2001 09:20:16, 35200 bytes
              Cap Flags: 0x41
           Format Flags: 0xFFF

-----------
USB Devices
-----------
+ USB Root Hub
| Vendor/Product ID: 0x1106, 0x3038
| Matching Device ID: usb\root_hub
| Service: usbhub
| Driver: usbhub.sys, 8/23/2001 13:00:00, 50688 bytes
| Driver: usbd.sys, 8/23/2001 13:00:00, 4736 bytes

----------------
Gameport Devices
----------------
+ VIA AC'97 Audio Controller (WDM)
| Location: PCI bus 0, device 7, function 5
| Matching Device ID: pci\ven_1106&dev_3058
| Service: VIAudio
| Driver: ac97via.sys, 8/17/2001 09:20:16, 35200 bytes
| Driver: drmk.sys, 8/17/2001 11:01:20, 57344 bytes
| Driver: portcls.sys, 8/17/2001 19:24:38, 135040 bytes
| Driver: stream.sys, 7/9/2004 04:27:28, 48512 bytes
| Driver: wdmaud.drv, 8/23/2001 13:00:00, 22016 bytes
| Driver: ksuser.dll, 12/12/2002 00:14:32, 4096 bytes
|
+-+ Standard Game Port
| | Matching Device ID: *pnpb02f
| | Service: gameenum
| | Driver: gameenum.sys, 8/17/2001 11:02:32, 9728 bytes



I hope you guys know, I really do appreciate all your help here.

jsalemi, I do have DirectX 9.0c, I'm  not sure if it needs updating?

Dr. Beast, I tried your test with the "Slow Motion 0" in the cheat window, but didn't make any difference.

Hegelian, I have downloaded and installed unified driver packs ("Hyperion") for VIA chipsets from VIA's Web site. Still the slow motion sims.

Its just so weird, there's got to be something I'm missing.  The loading screen loads normally, not in slow motion, the loading video plays better than ever, the graphics all look great, but as soon as I click on a neighborhood screen, Pleasantville, Verona, etc, the neighborhood drift is in slow motion and in any lot, the sims refuse to play at a normal speed!!   

Is there anything in debug mode that could give me a clue?