Lag, what could I upgrade.

[silverkitty]

Dell
Windows 7 Home Premium - 64 bit
Dual Core AMD Athlon II X2 250 Processer @ 3.00 GHz
7 GB RAM
NVIDIA GeForce GT 430 Graphics Card

I have a decent amount of on and off lag using Awesomemod, a few of Twallan's mods and a rather small collection of build/buy and CAS CC. I have no other game issues outside of that.  What here would be best to upgrade to eliminate the lag, or at least minimize it?  What other information should I provide if this isn't enough to go off of. Thanks ahead of time!

[jezzer]

Reviews for your video card suggest it is low-performing and not really recommended for gaming on anything but lower video settings.  Try lowering your video settings and see if that improves your performance.

[silverkitty]

Thank you, will do for now and hopefully soon I'll upgrade it, I hate looking at the graphics on low settings...  Everything is annoyingly big and fuzzy >.<  I have had it set very low in the past, runs a lot smoother but still has occasional (every 2 - 5 minutes give or take) freezes that last anywhere from 3 seconds to 30.  Even with no mods installed I'll get those, getting progressively worse the longer I've played that particular save.  A few generations in I usually just start over.  Any recommendations for a specific card?

[mephlabs]

I'm have very the same specs as you, few things to consider.

- Sims 3 is only at 32bits. So don't buy more ram, with 7 is enough for the System. (2 for Windows and 4 for gaming). (but if you are using value ram, change to at least, some mushkins with cooler).

- Athlon II 250 is quite enough, but if you are using a lot of custom content, I suggest you to change to Phenom X4 or better.
- I'm using a HD6770, quite enough for sims3 and a lot of games including the latest one. (Not considering MAXPayne3 or something), but enough for the upcoming BlackOPS2. or similar.

You will getting lag anyways, cuz Sims 3 is horrible optimized and codded, just a piece of shit in terms of structure, so my best, try to change the CPU and the Video. (and the PSupply of course). or not, you will have some little freezes specially with the reflections and shadows.

[silverkitty]

I'm have very the same specs as you, few things to consider.

- Sims 3 is only at 32bits. So don't buy more ram, with 7 is enough for the System. (2 for Windows and 4 for gaming). (but if you are using value ram, change to at least, some mushkins with cooler).

- Athlon II 250 is quite enough, but if you are using a lot of custom content, I suggest you to change to Phenom X4 or better.
- I'm using a HD6770, quite enough for sims3 and a lot of games including the latest one. (Not considering MAXPayne3 or something), but enough for the upcoming BlackOPS2. or similar.

You will getting lag anyways, cuz Sims 3 is horrible optimized and codded, just a piece of shit in terms of structure, so my best, try to change the CPU and the Video. (and the PSupply of course). or not, you will have some little freezes specially with the reflections and shadows.

I guess I'll probably look at the processor first, and then maybe the card.  I'm honestly debating just going ahead and just getting an i7... I *probably* won't regret it.  I do use the computer for World of Warcraft raiding, D3 and occasionally I pop on Star Wars: The Old Republic (when I feel like paying the sub)...  So it will help with multiple things. Thank you, I'm not too knowledgeable about all of this myself so it's nice to get some advice!

[jezzer]

I would honestly recommend updating your video card first, because I guarantee* that's where most of your bottleneck is happening.  A decent video card would help lighten up the load on your processor, as would shutting down background programs while you're gaming.


*"guarantee" is a strong word; let's go with "think"

[mephlabs]

I can agree with Jezzer.

Also, if you are gonna change to Intel, you must change your motherboard, thing that will create more pain in your pocket, and as I said before, also need to upgrade your PSU. (if you don't have a good one).

[silverkitty]

I would honestly recommend updating your video card first, because I guarantee* that's where most of your bottleneck is happening.  A decent video card would help lighten up the load on your processor, as would shutting down background programs while you're gaming.


*"guarantee" is a strong word; let's go with "think"

Video card it is then.  I would like to go somewhere in the upper 500 or lower 600 GeForce range... Currently my power supply isn't enough to upgrade, but to upgrade both should only be a few hundred, not too bad.  Not as much as a new PC!

I can agree with Jezzer.

Also, if you are gonna change to Intel, you must change your motherboard, thing that will create more pain in your pocket, and as I said before, also need to upgrade your PSU. (if you don't have a good one).

Sucks, I wasn't aware of that.  It makes me kick myself for not just buying a computer with a better processer to begin with.  When I got the computer I couldn't find one with an i7 that didn't have intigrated graphics, and none of the OEM were enough.  I ended up just buying a cheap pc and replacing the card. Looking back I should have just waited and built my own, but my own impatience got the best of me! >.<

[jezzer]

Don't just buy hardware upgrades all willy-nilly.  Check your motherboard's specs to see how upgradable it is.  You should be able to find that information on your manufacturer's website; it should tell you what hardware it comes with, and how powerful you can upgrade it to.  My computer is an HP Pavilion that came with a dual-core processor, 5 GB of RAM, an integrated crappy video card, and a dinky PSU, but it had a lot of flexibility for upgrading.  I've since converted to a 6-core CPU, 12 GB of RAM, a GeForce 570 GT video card, and a 585w PSU.

[silverkitty]

Don't just buy hardware upgrades all willy-nilly.  Check your motherboard's specs to see how upgradable it is.  You should be able to find that information on your manufacturer's website; it should tell you what hardware it comes with, and how powerful you can upgrade it to.  My computer is an HP Pavilion that came with a dual-core processor, 5 GB of RAM, an integrated crappy video card, and a dinky PSU, but it had a lot of flexibility for upgrading.  I've since converted to a 6-core CPU, 12 GB of RAM, a GeForce 570 GT video card, and a 585w PSU.

It's a process I plan to take slowly, I just want to figure out what will help curb my frustrations the most.  I'll check the website, I do remember when I got it that one of my reasonings was it was the most upgradable option that was available in the store at the time, but it's been a while so I'm not sure.  Than you again, it's very helpful.  Envy your machine!

[witch]

I've just built a new PC in the last couple of weeks and want to pass on a tip I was given. Apparently if you have an Nvidia video card and later on want to use SLI with another card, you will need the identical Nvidia card. Whereas if you go with ATI Radeon, you will be able to do Crossfire as long as you have a similar GPU. I thought Crossfire might be a cheap way of upgrading my video card in a year or two.

HDDs can be a bottleneck too. When I was researching parts for my new PC, I discovered a lot of the new HDDs are labelled 'green' and often run as slow as a notebook/laptop drive i.e. 5700rpm. I don't game with any less than 10K rpm and the faster read/write can help with the over all system. In my old machine I had 2 smaller HDDs and put them in RAID 0 which helped keep my now 5 year old machine up to the task for a lot longer.

If you get a secondary HDD for data, you can also put Windoze page file on that, save having to access your main drive(s) for that as well as what you're doing.

[silverkitty]

I've just built a new PC in the last couple of weeks and want to pass on a tip I was given. Apparently if you have an Nvidia video card and later on want to use SLI with another card, you will need the identical Nvidia card. Whereas if you go with ATI Radeon, you will be able to do Crossfire as long as you have a similar GPU. I thought Crossfire might be a cheap way of upgrading my video card in a year or two.

This is very interesting, it's the first I've heard of Crossfire.  After looking it up I'm quite interested, thank you for mentioning it!

[Dark Trepie]

I have the exact same card.  It runs well enough without having to sacrifice too much.  I knocked the view distance options down a couple of notches and that was all I needed.  That being said you probably got it for the same reason I did.  I was looking for a video card on the cheap and found it on Newegg for $60.  So, no, it's not the best card.  And yes, you will want to save up for a better one.

HDDs can be a bottleneck too. When I was researching parts for my new PC, I discovered a lot of the new HDDs are labelled 'green' and often run as slow as a notebook/laptop drive i.e. 5700rpm. I don't game with any less than 10K rpm and the faster read/write can help with the over all system. In my old machine I had 2 smaller HDDs and put them in RAID 0 which helped keep my now 5 year old machine up to the task for a lot longer.

I predict they will try to phase out the HDDs we have now in favor of solid state drives in a couple of years.  Then we can all sit around and laugh about how HDD's used to be clunky devices that had moving parts while we watch our computers boot up in five seconds.

[silverkitty]

I have the exact same card.  It runs well enough without having to sacrifice too much.  I knocked the view distance options down a couple of notches and that was all I needed.  That being said you probably got it for the same reason I did.  I was looking for a video card on the cheap and found it on Newegg for $60.  So, no, it's not the best card.  And yes, you will want to save up for a better one.

That is the exact reason I bought it.  I'd been playing (grudgingly) on a laptop for the past year and couldn't find a good enough excuse to dump the money on a new computer.  Then TOR was released and I couldn't play for more than 10 minutes without overheating, and even if I could it was too laggy to be enjoyable.  So I went out and bought a budget pc that could play everything I play decently, expecting anything that could flawlessly run TOR could run Sims without much of a hitch.  I was wrong, but at least its got plenty of upgrade capability.

[witch]

I predict they will try to phase out the HDDs we have now in favor of solid state drives in a couple of years.  Then we can all sit around and laugh about how HDD's used to be clunky devices that had moving parts while we watch our computers boot up in five seconds.

Yiss, my new PC has a SSD. It is actually 7 seconds to boot to desktop, but who's quibbling?   

[SJActress]

Rather than start my own thread, out of curiosity, what do you guys think of the ATI Radeon HD 5570 graphics card? It came with my PC. I am fairly educated when it comes to PC specs, with the exception of graphics cards. I know it has 1 gig of dedicated memory, and I know that's far better than the last card I had (I previously bought an HP Touchsmart. What a mistake THAT was!), but I don't know if it's all that decent.

[witch]

My old PC had a 4870 (with 1GB RAM) and although I had lags, including during online games, it was still managing on lower settings. Your card is a whole series later so it's probably fine for now. How's your performance? If you are getting frustrated with gaming it is maybe NOT good enough.

[silverkitty]

My old PC had a 4870 (with 1GB RAM) and although I had lags, including during online games, it was still managing on lower settings. Your card is a whole series later so it's probably fine for now. How's your performance? If you are getting frustrated with gaming it is maybe NOT good enough.

Honestly my performance for WoW, TOR and D3 is great, in WoW I run 50 - 70 fps outside, 100+ in buildings and 100+ in most of the recent raid with all my settings on high. The only times I have lag is on a couple of fights with a lot of spell graphics, and its not enough to really bother me.  Eliminating it would be a plus, but not really needed.  In TOR, to be honest I hit level 45 and quit, but it through all the leveling content in ran smoothly, I couldn't max out the graphics without suffering some, but on a medium to high-ish settings it worked smoothly. The only issues I've had for D3 have been server side. Then in Sims I run I'll run 30 - 45 fps, which is perfectly good enough, but have constant lag spikes where I drop down to 5 fps, then it shoots back up again.  Rendering objects takes a long time and like I said in an earlier post I have strange 3 - 30 second game freezes where the game acts like it's paused (sims and objects freeze but the plumbob keeps spinning).  I've tried taking out all the CC and mods, still have those.  Honestly with and without CC my performance seems about the same, I do have a little bit more lag with Awesomemod installed but not much.  Lowering my resolution and graphics gets rid of most of the fps drops, however the 3 - 30 second freezes stay, and I can't bear to look at my game.  Uninstalling and re-installing doesn't fix the problem.  I've just assumed up to this point it's because WoW, TOR and D3 are all online only games, so a large portion of the content is hosted on the server, rather than on my computer so it doesn't have to work as hard.

If I didn't play quite as much as I did it wouldn't really matter to me, but in between raid nights there really is nothing to do so I play Sims.... A lot. lol

[witch]

I don't believe the difference in performance between online games and the sims can be put down to server side stuff. Your local machine still needs to render the images you see, no matter what you are playing. I think it's the sims itself. It's always been said that the sims is a very processor oriented game, yet I have also heard that it is not intelligently coded enough to take advantage of extra cores. I use the frame limiter app Pescado has on this site for the sims and I still experienced lag spikes and rendering pauses at 30 fps with the old machine.

[silverkitty]

I don't believe the difference in performance between online games and the sims can be put down to server side stuff. Your local machine still needs to render the images you see, no matter what you are playing. I think it's the sims itself. It's always been said that the sims is a very processor oriented game, yet I have also heard that it is not intelligently coded enough to take advantage of extra cores. I use the frame limiter app Pescado has on this site for the sims and I still experienced lag spikes and rendering pauses at 30 fps with the old machine.

Well hopefully upgrading the processor will fix most of the problems that aren't coding related! -hopes-

[SJActress]

My old PC had a 4870 (with 1GB RAM) and although I had lags, including during online games, it was still managing on lower settings. Your card is a whole series later so it's probably fine for now. How's your performance? If you are getting frustrated with gaming it is maybe NOT good enough.

I really only play TS3 and GTA Vice City and San Andreas. I have absolutely no issues with them with high detail. However, the GTAs are old, so I partially attribute it to that. The only newer game that I own that I've had issues with is GTA IV, but it was such a horrific port that I don't know if it's my card or the game. It has a small lag every 10 seconds or so (perhaps an FPS issue, but I've been unable to fix it). Not that it matters. The "realistic" physics in that game piss me off so bad I can't play for more than 10 minutes at a time. I don't enjoy driving a bunch of cars that handle like dump trucks.

[Skadi]

Silverkitty. I play a similar game profile to you: D3, WoW (previously) and TS3. I found that most of my D3 problems are Blizz related with lag and rubberbanding being a serverside issue that would be worse after new patches.
I use an AMD X6 1155t with 6gb ram and a GTS250 (old-ish). Cooling is a bit of an issue in summer since the ambient air temp gets to 35'c but other than that it's okay.

Have you checked your CC? I would have a  HUGE issue every now and again with bad CC and TS3. Process Monitor would show the game choking as it tried to load a hair over and over again, thousands of times. It gave me odd lag and low FPS from time to time, removing the bad CC fixed the problem. Keeping your high detail lots option to the lower end (1 or 2) can help as well.  

Lastly with hardware: Later EPs added Large Address Aware coding to TS3, so it should work better in rigs with more than 4gb of ram. Ram and video cards are easy upgrade, and for the most part they will carry over if you end up doing a complete rebuild in the next 12 months. The good news is that most mobos to suit your CPU are an AM3 socket. Double check, but if it is and you can get new bios software, you can upgrade it all the way to a 6 core like mine and jezzers without needing to replace it. Today I was able to have 19 windows open, including 4 browser windows with a total of 44 tabs, photoshop and TS3 running minimised in the background (don't ask). I wouldn't necessarily go upgrading stuff off the bat though. TS3 has a lot of sloppy code and bad CC that can cause the game to behave badly. I would investigate that first before buying more hardware, unless you are upgrading for the heck of it.

[silverkitty]

Skadi - I've removed all cc previously to check for that, as well as uninstalling... Still there =(. 19 windows!!! I have Photoshop CS5 on my computer and I do occasionally have a lot of delay when smudging very large pictures with large brushes.  However I doubt I could ever run it well with anything extra besides my browser up.  D3's servers have had lots off issues lately, and WoW because everyone is fixing D3. Last Tuesday half of my raid dc'd because Battle.net is having issues... Happened on multiple servers at the same time. 

Later today my husband is getting a new computer (his is my old pc that's about 8 years old) because it is repeatedly frying graphics cards.  It's gonna have an i7, 650 watt ps,  GeForce 550ti video card and either 12 or 16 gbs of ram, have not decided on that yet.  Once it's all set up im going to install all the games and copy my Sims 3 folder from my documents with all my current saves and content and see how it runs in comparison.

[Skadi]

If you are getting a new shiny, use a framerate limiter. TS3 is coded so that it will just keep pushing the framerate as high as it can until your video card dies. There is no v-sync option either. Use the FPS limiter from this site, or EVGA or NVidia tools, whatever you prefer. Pescado discovered that despite the game pushing out in excess of 150fps, it only actually draws 30fps, so there is no reason to let it go that high. I use the 3booter + fps limiter to keep it at 30fps for the sake of my card. On menus and paused it would pump out 2000+fps sending the card to 91'c before making me freak out.

[mephlabs]

I will ask for permission to hang up from this thread:

Witch, what are your specs, because your game looks pretty neat. Or I'm bad because I can't get full antialised game. (even playing with Catalyst).

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/84062723/Screens/Screenshot-5.jpg