Is T$R at it again?

[Capitaine Marie]

Sims 2 Artists was hacked a couple days ago.  Innocent until proven guilty, etc.; but with T$R's track record, I wouldn't be surprised if it were them.  Though it's stooping to T$R's level, has anyone considered returning the favor? 

[Motoki]

This would probably be better suited for a post at Paysites Must Be Destroyed, but I don't know, is the TS2 cc community really a big threat for them anymore?

OTOH, I wouldn't put it past them either...

[BlueSoup]

The owners of Sims 2 Artists and TSR have history of the not-good variety.  I wouldn't be surprised.

[Inge]

Weird thing is there were no hackings during their month's holiday, and they've just started back into the office this week...  I still don't believe they're doing it, but whoever is certainly knows how to time things to incriminate them!

[BlueSoup]

They hacked my petition last year.  Why wouldn't you believe it's them?

[uknortherner]

Especially considering TSR's track record in the past, ranging from hacking attacks on MTS2, GOS, numerous Photobucket accounts and of course that now-famous petition right through to outright theft of CC and magazine screenshots (a desperate attempt by Steve to claim an "exclusive" on Sims Medieval), I wouldn't put one damn thing past them, especially with that poisoned racist dwarf Atwat around.

With their dirty track record, how anyone can even remotely defend these lowlife cunts is anyone's guess.

[Inge]

But you can't strengthen current speculation with past speculation and cause it to become evidence     We don't have any clear evidence they ever hacked anyone.  The only things I have seen credible evidence of are that personal contact details of members were shared with FAs and that Steve posted a TSR article in a way that led people to believe for a short time that he was the source of the information when he was not.  Those are evidence of poor judgement, but not direct evidence of hacking.   Everything that they "could have done" with information they had, could have been also done by others with similar information and without the approval or knowledge of TSR management.

[uknortherner]

Err, Inge - Did you forget the Buggybooz incident over at MTS? You know, the one where her account was hacked, her TOU were changed to be paysite friendly and finally her content stolen only to reappear under Shakeshaft's account as pay content? The one where the IP address matched a proxy used by Thomas himself back when he created an account to "hire" free CC creators for TSR?

I'm fully aware that you take a lot of these accusations with a pinch of salt (or indeed, an entire salt mine's worth) but the evidence is right there.

But, let's go back to that petition for a moment. 629 people signed it (including me), and TSR ended up with a list of 614(?) people who they were more than happy to publish for the world to see. How did TSR get hold of this list in the first place? We know it was the petition list because it contained names several MATYans made up to have a go at BlueSoup, and surprise, surprise, those names were on the leaked list. TSR have shown in the past that they are not adverse to sharing private data among themselves and their paysite pals.

True, we get the village idiot Johan popping up here and over at PMBD to protest his innocence, but he pisses off at the first opportunity he gets, and oddly enough was nowhere to be found when false allegations were made against GOS which led to GoDaddy shutting them down for a while.

So yes, I am more than willing to believe that TSR had a hand in this. This is exactly their style.

[Inge]

The whole point of proxy IPs is they don't identify people.  And we didn't see the logs anyway - BESIDES which, istr, Delphy himself who possibly did see his logs said he didn't see any clear evidence to implicate TSR.

And how did TSR get hold of the petition list?  Yes, how did they?  And did they?  Maybe there is a tattletale.  Maybe there is a hobbyist hacker in the inner circle who thought it would be fun to make trouble when the blame was likely to fall elsewhere.  Or maybe it was a strategic fake hacking calculated to be blamed on TSR.  Most of us don't really know each other very well.  Looking for firm evidence without having access to anything other than each other's internet presence is really a waste of time.  You need to be able to seize people's computers, or verify they are online at the time these things happened.

Still, the speculation continues to be a fun pastime.

(edited to correct MTS to TSR lol)

[J. M. Pescado]

I certainly see every sign that TSR has been associated with past acts, although there is no particular evidence at this time to link them to this one.

[Capitaine Marie]

Whether it's TSR this time, or not, I still say they deserve to be hacked.  I just don't have that ability, dang it.

[Skadi]

IPs match those used by the proxy service they like to use, and the attack had a "personal" feel to it.
I figure Atwat, personally.

[Zazazu]

Whether it's TSR this time, or not, I still say they deserve to be hacked.  I just don't have that ability, dang it.

Just because one side is made of a bunch of bully dickwads, that doesn't mean that we need to be the same.

[Capitaine Marie]

Just because one side is made of a bunch of bully dickwads, that doesn't mean that we need to be the same.

Of course, you're right; I'm just still really ticked off about it.

[J. M. Pescado]

Plus, it would be stupid and unnecessarily destroy a vital intelligence asset.

[Kittycataussie]

vital intelligence asset.

sorry, if I just read all that right the comment was rather funny.... I'm also coming off a third-shift waitress night so don't mind my missing mind. I'm just gonna go back to lurking mode now. 

[tjstreak]

 Looking for firm evidence without having access to anything other than each other's internet presence is really a waste of time.  

Proving anything can be difficult.  However, in a murder case, you don't always need a body.  In a robbery, you don't always need to find the stolen goods.

What you can look at is past conduct and current practices.  You can look at things like means and motive.  And you can draw inferences from behavior.

One thing we know for certain is that TSR is not an honest business.  Take for example, their use of other's intellectual property.  TSR pilfers the work of other artists on almost a daily basis.  I am not talking about sims artists, but artist artists.  You see items containing Disney's copyrighted material all the time.  At one point, I did a cursory search and found over 50 items which used material copyrighted by Disney.  However, they also host artwork from professional artists who are not even aware that their artwork has been taken, converted into sims custom content and is sold.  Just log in, and you will find page after page of paintings and similar artwork containing the copyrighted material of other artists.

How does an honest business act?  Well, just compare TSR's conduct to EA.  Yes, we all love to hate EA, but it is a professional operation.  EA is very careful about infringing on other's copyrights.  Branded material is identified and the rights to use that material are secured before those items are published.

Now, this does not prove that TSR has hacked into other accounts, but it tells you something about TSR's mindset.  They are neither a professional nor an honest business.

[Claeric]

That's pretty questionable "past conduct" to "make inferences" with, though. The average person isn't going to secure copyrights for images they can easily find on the internet. Are we to believe that all those wacky korean creators who plaster disney imagery over half their content are shady and not to be trusted? Not likely. So why does that apply to TSR?

You're trying to make it sound like the fact that they do it makes it blatantly malicious, but that's not true at all.

Not that I'm defending TSR, just that "They use images of disney stuff!!!" is a really flimsy basis to prove intent and maliciousness.

[jezzer]

That's pretty questionable "past conduct" to "make inferences" with, though. The average person isn't going to secure copyrights for images they can easily find on the internet. Are we to believe that all those wacky korean creators who plaster disney imagery over half their content are shady and not to be trusted? Not likely. So why does that apply to TSR?

You're trying to make it sound like the fact that they do it makes it blatantly malicious, but that's not true at all.

Not that I'm defending TSR, just that "They use images of disney stuff!!!" is a really flimsy basis to prove intent and maliciousness.

Because they're a paysite.  A paysite using copyrighted material without permission.  A paysite that uses copyrighted material without permission and throws MASSIVE BUTTHURT HISSYFITS if anyone "infringes" on their work.  How hard is that to understand?

[Jeeves]

As hard as decrapifying is, apparently.

[tjstreak]

The average person isn't going to secure copyrights for images they can easily find on the internet.

TSR is not the average person.  They are a business, and specifically a business which sells custom content.  That it is a commercial enterprise, as opposed to a hobbyist, makes all of the difference in the world.

Say you buy a DVD on E-Bay.  When you receive it, you discover that it is a homemade copy.  In fact, the seller did nothing more than download a torrent with the movie on it, an burned it on the DVD.  You have been defrauded.  You thought you were buying a legitimate copy of the DVD, and you rightfully assumed that the seller had the rights to sell you what he was selling you.  This is little different from a grocer who puts his thumb on the scale, a pawnshop which sells stolen goods, or a financial institution which sells fraudulent securities.

And while TSR's conduct may not be malicious, it is knowing.  Everything which is uploaded to the site is reviewed.  Now obviously, they are looking for things like stray boobies, because they will not allow a stray boobie or a naughty word, like "bitch."  However, they clearly are indifferent as to whether someone is uploading stolen property.  Clearly, they are sanctioning the illegal use of other people's intellectual property.  They know what they are doing, so while their conduct may not be malicious in the sense that they are trying to hurt artists, it is deliberate and intentional.

In fact, everthing that TSR sells is violative of EA's copyrights because EA limits the use of its intellectual property for non-commercial uses only.  While a hobbyist can use EA's software, meshes and the like, another business cannot.  TSR's whole business model is a criminal enterprise.

Now, perhap Disney is not particularly sympathetic because they are a big nasty corporation.  But they are also a big nasty corporation which could do nasty things to TSR.  If TSR thumbs their nose at a badass like Disney, how do you think they would treat some poor schmuck who cannot fight with them.  It's clear that they are not following the rules of acceptable behavior for a business.

We also know they have abused the copyright laws in efforts to shut down other sites, like Garden of Shadows.  They claim copyrights to materials which they know they do not have a copyright on, and then they send take down notices to the ISPs of these sites, knowing that their copyright claims are bogus.

This conduct is indisputable.  And what is the real gist of the original post?  That TSR has hacked into someone's account, or that TSR is a disreputable business which engages in dishonest business practices and sells stolen property, and that it does not let the norms of acceptable behavior restrain them in the quest for money?

Given this, do you think they would hesitate to engage in other illegal conduct?

[J. M. Pescado]

I don't think it really matters whether anyone likes Disney or wants to support them. The point is that you can sic them on TSR.