TSR HAS DOXED YOU!

[adalita]

My info is there and the only way they got it is from TSR. It doesn't matter as it isn't my real info anyway but I still think it is rude.

[Inge]

Thomas made it quite clear to me in a private MSN chat that TSR had authorised the passing of personal user details to TSR creators, and that he felt it was completely justified.  That is how they got to Dot, ATWA etc.    I don't know whether he told them to publish them onwards, or if they made that decision for themselves.

[brownlustgirl]

Well, I am on the list. The info is an old e-mail that doesn't have anything personal on it, the info on it is wrong, like 5 yrs old. I just want to know how I can be a pirate when I have never had a subscription with them, just signed a stupid petition. What is it with these people, you can't publicly be in disagreement with them?

[mistyk]

TSR is probably looking for new ways to get people to stop file sharing, since having everyone's mediafire accounts banned only made people start torrenting their stuff on TPB where TSR can not get it removed, they must be really pissed...no matter what they do they will never stop the file sharing.
I am not on that list, and I didn't sign the petition, but I never use real info on the interwebz.

[J. M. Pescado]

It's never going to work, though. Companies with far more money and far stronger legal positions have failed to stop filesharing, and there's no chance in hell TSR can manage it.

[Dragon Slave]

Since TS3's EULA condones sharing of CC they have no leg to stand on anyways.  Every justification they use is bull.  I'm just relieved I no longer feel the need to go that virus infested crap hole anymore.  The only FA's I ever followed were Cashcraft and Cyclonesue.  The rest of them just keep getting worse.

[Jujube]

Inge, Would you be willing to elaborate on your conversation with Thomas? No matter how I look at it I cannot come up with a logically justified reason for him to spread around that information, especially since it is not his information to spread around. It was not public and no one on that list gave permission for him nor anyone else on TSR to see it.

[rum nate]

Coconut made a new post which looked at TSR's privacy policy to show what they do, and don't, guarantee.

http://tsr.mustbedestroyed.org/?p=874

[GoddessByline]

I haven't been active in the community for years now. But someone emailed me and informed me that I had the honour of making it to that list.
The really funny thing though is, that while I did create a TSR account back in TS1 days, I have never even once subscribed to that site, so what the heck am I supposed to have shared?
My guess is that my name made it to that list since TSR on a regulare basis have stole my stuff and had members post it as their creations in the past, and when I have told them about it and asked to have my stuff removed, or at least be given credit, I have been meet with defening silence at best, or rude replies that there's no way to prove that the suff is created by me.

Anyway, only thing to do about this, is to point my finger and laugh at them. Do anyone really take them seriously anymore, besides themselves I mean?

[Liz]

TSR has released a news item on this issue...

If you have any concerns we would urge you to read our Privacy Policy which we believe demonstrates that we take our members' privacy very seriously.

That gave me a nice case of the roffles: "You can totally trust us because we say you can. No, srsly!"

[Drakron]

I think that Privacy Statement is pretty standard, the issue comes from liability and TSR shown again and again they have no control over their staff.

One thing is when someone from EA leaks information as that person is employed at EA with a contract were there will be a liability damage clause so all damage will be paid by that person.

TSR on the other hand ... I doubt they have contracts with their staff, at least LEGAL contracts (not verbal contracts) so they can run amok without a care in the world, in fact that seems how A TAWT acts since every time there is stupid from TSR it comes from her.

[J. M. Pescado]

We have a very simple privacy policy here: "Don't ask, don't tell.". We simply don't ask for it, so it's not like we could give it up even if threatened with painful death. That's a REAL privacy policy. Everything else is worthless.

[Drakron]

On the other hand this seems to be information coming from hacking PettitionOnline and put up for reasons beyond human, subhuman, unhuman and bestial understanding.

What the hell were they going to do? go to EA with the names and Email addresses from that petition and ask then to do what? its not as if EA cares about TSR anyway despite their illusions about that.

It makes no sense, it seems Thomas spends a lot of time to clean up A TWAT messes because she is special and unless she allows him to stick it in her pooper on a regular basis I cannot understand why the hell he puts up with that crap.

[Tever]

On the other hand this seems to be information coming from hacking PettitionOnline and put up for reasons beyond human, subhuman, unhuman and bestial understanding.

What the hell were they going to do? go to EA with the names and Email addresses from that petition and ask then to do what? its not as if EA cares about TSR anyway despite their illusions about that.

It makes no sense, it seems Thomas spends a lot of time to clean up A TWAT messes because she is special and unless she allows him to stick it in her pooper on a regular basis I cannot understand why the hell he puts up with that crap.

But don't you understand? With fake names and web-based emails, EA can put a stop to piracy for good! We're all doomed! DOOMED, I say!

[Chrissi]

We have a very simple privacy policy here: "Don't ask, don't tell.". We simply don't ask for it, so it's not like we could give it up even if threatened with painful death. That's a REAL privacy policy. Everything else is worthless.

By the way do you specifically block real-sounding emails?  I am not terribly concerned about online privacy (probably because I've never had a problem in all the >10 years I've been online and giving out real info), maybe I should start being concerned, but anyway....

When I tried to sign up with this site it took me like an hour because it kept refusing me, saying I look like a bot, or I haven't answered the questions correctly.  I was concerned that my Monty Python knowledge was failing me, so I googled as much as I could and could not come up with any other possible answers.  Finally, on a hunch, I decided to change my email, and suddenly it let me register.

[Grimma]

TSR has released a news item on this issue...

If you have any concerns we would urge you to read our Privacy Policy which we believe demonstrates that we take our members' privacy very seriously.

That gave me a nice case of the roffles: "You can totally trust us because we say you can. No, srsly!"

This is especially lulzy if one actually READS their "privacy" policy (or the Cocunut post about it).

[Inge]

Inge, Would you be willing to elaborate on your conversation with Thomas? No matter how I look at it I cannot come up with a logically justified reason for him to spread around that information, especially since it is not his information to spread around. It was not public and no one on that list gave permission for him nor anyone else on TSR to see it.

Yes, the situation arose from the fact that there was technical collaboration on the creation of modding tools, which has already been discussed, and I spent quite a bit of time in a chat room that included such people as Delphy, HP, Tiger (of the hood editor) Johan, Pommes, Murano and Thomas of TSR among others.  Johan, who is Thomas's twin brother is a really nice guy.  I am sure if he was in charge, TSR would have a very different face.

At the beginning, before the chatroom really got off the ground, MSN details were exchanged between myself and the TSR people.  Thomas would occasionally PM me via that, and pass on technical stuff to and from his programmers.  Sometimes he would fish for gossip, and I made it clear I wasn't going to act as any sort of double agent.  One day, in fact the last time I ever had communication with him, he asked whether as a person who seemed fairly neutral between the paysites and the rest of the community what I thought about the feuds between them, and TSR's position in the community   I told him that since he was asking my opinion I felt that TSR's reputation was reasonably good in the days they had all items in rotation and maybe he could go back to something like that.   I also told him I thought it was quite wrong of the owners to have shared customers' personal data with people other than admins (ie creators etc), and that this was a huge part of the loss of TSR's reputation.   He responded that he felt it was entirely justified to have shared this information with creators whose work was being stolen.   The conversation ended soon after that and we haven't spoken directly since.

[Honeywell]

Inge, Would you be willing to elaborate on your conversation with Thomas? No matter how I look at it I cannot come up with a logically justified reason for him to spread around that information, especially since it is not his information to spread around. It was not public and no one on that list gave permission for him nor anyone else on TSR to see it.

Yes, the situation arose from ...

That right there is some good shit!  I don't even care about this bit of drama one way or the other and I was fascinated.  Forget MOAR fight, I want MOAR double secret agent action.   

[Sigmund]

Sims 3 modder by day, secret agent by night. Inge, you need a trench coat or something. At the very least a fedora.

[Assmitten]

Sims 3 modder by day, secret agent by night. Inge, you need a STRAIGHT JACKET or something. At the very least a fedora.

Fixed.

[Zazazu]

I think that Privacy Statement is pretty standard, the issue comes from liability and TSR shown again and again they have no control over their staff.

It is a pretty standard privacy statement. I'm one of those weird people who reads the full text of everything she agrees to, and nothing in their statement jumps out as odd. However, as you've hinted at, it's the implimentation that is an issue. Any other company would only share personal information in these situations:

1. To second-party or third-party advertisers, as allowed via the specifics of the Privacy Agreement (this is why you read the things), and generally then only demographics, no name or address.
2. In the case of subpeona from a government agency regarding a suit.
3. In the case of illegal action taken by a "member" against them or their property, then only using the information in a court of law.

Notice there's nothing about swapping personal information based on conjecture to other entities. Nothing about making largely baseless accusations against someone and then giving a bunch of people their full names and emails, sometimes phone numbers, to do with as they will. Nope. That's the sort of thing that TSR does, and that's the reason why even a small leak or spreading information that technically didn't originate from them, is extremely alarming.

I would bet that there is something in that e-petition's site regarding unauthorized third-party hacking and usage of information obtained via hacking, and I'd bet that at the least Thomas and Atwat specifically are in violation of that, if not TSR as a whole.

[J. M. Pescado]

1. To second-party or third-party advertisers, as allowed via the specifics of the Privacy Agreement (this is why you read the things), and generally then only demographics, no name or address.
2. In the case of subpeona from a government agency regarding a suit.
3. In the case of illegal action taken by a "member" against them or their property, then only using the information in a court of law.

You will note how all of these weasel-exceptions are exactly the situations you DON'T want your information being shared in. Therefore, all "privacy policies" other than "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" are a joke, entirely without value, and not worth the pixels they are printed with. Don't share your information merely because someone asks: Lie first, you lose nothing.

[Drakron]

Some times its required, Amazon for example is going to require billing information and "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" is not going to work.

I understand since TSR does have a subscription system they will require billing information and just proves how screwed up their staff are when they just disclose that type of information, especially since that happens to be a crime.

In fact I wonder why nobody bothered to inform PayPal about TSR disclosing that privilege information when it happened, I might not like Navesea "pirate list" but at least they keep it at username only.

[J. M. Pescado]

Some times its required, Amazon for example is going to require billing information and "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" is not going to work.

'swhat Gypsy Paypal is for. Like I said, giving people information is optional. You can always lie, as long you construct a set of lies that will get you what you want. Always think of a way to lie around giving anyone dox.

[SealJuice]

I wish I was on the list. All the cool kids are. Everyone should write Thomass and ask to be put on the list. It's not fair to leave us off like that. It's discrimination I tell ya.