TS3 was to include weather.

[Buzzler]

EAxis care about their customers' money

Here, fixed that for ya.

I fail to see the difference. If they want the customer's money, they have to offer him a product he's willing to give them his money for.

How else can you defend the extremely high 'Store' prices for objects that should have been part of the game, or free?

I don't see how I defended them. Of course EAxis are in it for the money, I find it insulting that people even feel the need to mention that. What has changed is that EAxis are aiming more and more for the sheeples who are content to get the bare minimum for their money. That's why they can demand exorbitant prices for all "additional" content (which was free in times of TS1, and ceased to exist in times of TS2), and that's why vanilla TS3 feels like a raised middle finger with a price badge on it for non-sheeples.

[Alex]

EAxis care about their customers, I really believe they do.

Do you work for EA or something? You are clearly one of the sheeple to even consider saying that. I've never seen a company treat their customers with as much contempt as EA does. If they are showing any "care" for their customers, it's some half-assed attempt merely to hold their own against their newly merged, and much larger, rival.

[Buzzler]

Buzzler: we're using different interpretations of the meaning of 'care for'. In my view, that also implies respect: i.e. delivering a complete product, and not deliberately withholding features to sell them as addons for a premium. EA certainly does not respect its customers.

EA is a company driven by the hunger for profit, companies arent't able to "care" in a human way. I don't think it's necessary to argue about this. As for respect, companies above a certain size aren't able to have that either. Everything they offer, they offer for a reason. Sometimes it's a direct approach, then they charge customers for it. Sometimes it's more subtle, then they want to improve customer loyalty. Right now, they obviously don't see a need to improve the latter, that's why there going with the former, and they will do so as long as customer loyalty doesn't signaficantly erode.

[Ambular]

All eyes are towards simslice then surely  
How did they manage weather before the Seasons EP exactly?
Could they replicate it for TS3?

Unfortunately, all Simslice did with TS2 was enable the hidden weather effects that already existed in the game code.

[Ellatrue]

All eyes are towards simslice then surely  
How did they manage weather before the Seasons EP exactly?
Could they replicate it for TS3?

Unfortunately, all Simslice did with TS2 was enable the hidden weather effects that already existed in the game code.

Yes, and it was kind of screwed up. It was clear they didn't finish.

What I want to know is, why do I have all these random effects like seagulls at the beach, but no weather? Hello? Priorities! I could understand it for TS2, because it was clear that they really did run out of time, or at least failed in their attempts to add that feature. For TS3, I see it as the result of poor planning, at best.

[Orange]

Speaking of beaches, I'm still bummed out that you can't go for a swim at the beach, well, unless you build a pool there. I guess.

[ProfPlumbob]

They're in it for the money and they'll get every cent they can. If anyone ever thought they were in it for the game or the players, they need their heads checked. Get real. If they cared about the game or the players, they would be listening to all the forums on all the sites and none of the mods would even be necessary.

I've read arguments like this like a bazillion times in the last couple of months, and to me this still doesn't make any sense at all. It's just twisted. Before I can even think about leeching my customers tomorrow, I have to satisfy them today, and that means I have to care about their wants, a lot. A product has to be convincing on its own, future accessories aren't a factor for the original product's quality.

EAxis care about their customers, I really believe they do. There's only one setback: Most of the customers are sheeples, and they don't mind getting fucked by EAxis over and over again, they might not even notice. Even if they consider a feature uncomplete/unconvincing/borked/whatever they still cling to their hope EAxis would fix/improve it in the future, i.e. with the next EP, despite years of contrary experience.

no, what you really have is almost a bureaucracy at EA, where the Sims team REALLY cares about their customers but are cock blocked by those in the higher ups(can I say "cock blocked"?). But you have these higher up suits at EA that want to make sure their pockets and share holders are pleased.  So they make strict guidelines for the Sims team(and the rest of their devisions making games) to finish by, to rush the product out, so you end up getting a lot of stuff left on the cutting room floor.  Spend 4 months spending millions on marketing to get their profits looking good for the year, while it takes just days for Pescado to fix their shit and...well, hello?  Money is being spent in all the wrong areas.  Add to this, the fact that the millions EA is making off Sims 3 isn't all going into Sims 3, but to the suits, and to all the devisions at EA. 

Now imagine if Maxis were still its own company that doesn't have to listen to a big cooperation, where they can lay out the time and what they want in a game.  THAT is the company that is completely gone and/or too busy listening to higher ups of a billion dollar company.  That is a company that was led by someone like Pescado, and who are tragically lost in most of our gaming industry today.  The suits ruin everything.

[J. M. Pescado]

To be fair, Maxis got eaten by EA because they were essentially completely inept with financial management and manage to drive their company into bankruptcy. So no, they weren't run by someone like me.

As for the issue with "suits", "suits" don't run companies well because they don't WANT to run companies well: They want to maximize their short-term profits, burn the place to the ground, and sell the dessicated husk to some sucker, who thinks they can manage to milk this cow some more. If they succeed, one group of rapacious, greedy suits is replaced by an even worse lot. If the new owners fail, the company is consigned to the dustbin of history. Me, I take more of an Empire view: I see a company more as my Empire and manage in a way that it is stays intact and under my rule, and seek to crush my enemies.

[ProfPlumbob]

shhh...I was fluffing up Maxis and yourself more than I should have...back away...back away....

[Drakron]

Actually EA is more that happy to supply the rope they will hang themselves with ... that is what happen to Origin. In Maxis case they resisted to the bitter end, EA only did see then for SimCity with The Sims being a unexpected success.

[gtachampion]

There's only one setback: Most of the customers are sheeples, and they don't mind getting fucked by EAxis over and over again, they might not even notice. Even if they consider a feature uncomplete/unconvincing/borked/whatever they still cling to their hope EAxis would fix/improve it in the future, i.e. with the next EP, despite years of contrary experience.

Unfortunately we all have to be sheeples to a certain degree. Until someone else comes out with a game that rivals The Sims but it's worth playing in base form, we have to stick with what we can get. Fortunately we have geniuses like Pescado to make it a playable game and all the creators who make awesome creations so we can ignore the fugly EA crap. If there is another game out there, please direct me to it! Otherwise we have to take the base game and make something of it.

Therefore I still insist that EA doesn't care because they don't have to (until they get some competition....Pescado??)

Me, I take more of an Empire view: I see a company more as my Empire and manage in a way that it is stays intact and under my rule, and seek to crush my enemies.

All hail...King Pescado! I definitely agree. That is the way the company I work for is run.

[tjstreak]

I really don't have a problem with a company offerering optional features.  What I object to is the wait if those features actually are available.

I guess EA could have offered the program with all expansions already added in as part of the program.  Of course there would be a lot of bellyaching when they charged $500.00 for the program.  So would you rather pay for the program in bits and pieces choosing what options you really want, or would you rather pay a lot of money upfront and be forced to take options that you really don't want to pay for?

When I buy a car, I can buy the basic model, or I can purchase options like air conditioning, power steering and power brakes, a stereo system and so forth.  Of course, I do not expect to pay the same for a car without air conditioning as I would with a car with it.

So a lot of the whining about EA seems to be coming from people who want something for nothing.  Yes, I know gamers are fucking cheapass tightwads who don't want to pay for anything, and who whine incessantly if they get it for free.

I don't mind paying for it because I get more fun per dollar than just about anything else I do.  But if it is available now, why not let me purchase it now rather than dribbling it out in bits and pieces over the next few years?

Quite frankly, I want EA to make a lot of money off of this.  You see, if they make a lot of money, they will keep on making supplements and improvements to the game.  If they don't make money, the game dies.

[Czezechael]

I really don't have a problem with a company offering optional features.  What I object to is the wait if those features actually are available.

I don't know as that's the debate here; as far as I can tell it more has to do with EA withholding a procedural obvious-to-include feature to charge money for later, rather than the morality of them doing this. I think it's crap that they've axed pianos, hot tubs, and weather - of which the first two were just kinda implied by previous games, and the last one would have just been nice to not have to pay ~$30 for, especially since they've already got the base work down for it.

It's not immoral or horrible or anything, it's just stupid and disappointing and likely points to some kind of pathetic flaw in the human race, that we're content to keep waiting and paying for things that have already been done, even though a nicer alternative would be including the old stuff from the start and then, I don't know, adding legitimately new things to the series.

Plus, games don't necessarily die when official support for them falls out; a lot of the games I've played tend to have some overtly fanatical fans lying about in some country making half-bad/half-good unofficial patches and expansions for them. If a game does die, well, either it was simply too complicated for fans to sufficiently support, or it obviously wasn't worth keeping alive if nobody wanted to bother.

[chann]

Quite frankly, I want EA to make a lot of money off of this.  You see, if they make a lot of money, they will keep on making supplements and improvements to the game.  If they don't make money, the game dies.

EA not making money from making a good or improved game. They're profiting from the massive amount of money they shovel into marketing, which apparently "excuses" them from making any more than a functioning game that will visually appeal to their audience and impress game reviewers. Quantity over quality.

Feature hiding is only one symptom of the issue. I think most people are realistic enough to know they'll never get everything the first time around.

[StormchaserOne]

You people have forgotten SIMs 2 base game so quickly.  Majority of the EPs were already in base game it is the expansions which activate them.  With Wanton which JB found would be used for a Nightlife Expansion.  Weather Season Expansion.  Adventure Bon Voyage.  Found Pets for a Pet Expansion.  SIMs makes expansions because they do not want a base game running  $150.  Clothes and Objects only Packs are last minute additions which are not planned out.  And, there maybe a SIMs 4 around the corner if Expansions are a failure.

[ProfPlumbob]

You people have forgotten SIMs 2 base game so quickly.  Majority of the EPs were already in base game it is the expansions which activate them.  With Wanton which JB found would be used for a Nightlife Expansion.  Weather Season Expansion.  Adventure Bon Voyage.  Found Pets for a Pet Expansion.  SIMs makes expansions because they do not want a base game running  $150.  Clothes and Objects only Packs are last minute additions which are not planned out.  And, there maybe a SIMs 4 around the corner if Expansions are a failure.

lol, not planned out?  That's why they announced content to be released at their store BEFORE the base game came out.  And now they're doing it again with the expansion, announcing a lovely linup of new shiny premium priced furniture to go along with the release of World Adventures instead of including it with the expansion.  Last minute additions my butt, they're doing this on purpose.

it's not like everyone expected Sims 3 to include ALL the expansions.  Dating/nightlife, apartments, weather...those make since for Sims3.  A diving board freakin' makes sense.  Hot tubs?  Pinball machines? A violin to play at symphony's? Piano's?  I could keep going...so could many of us. 

So much content that was gimped from Sims 1 and Sims 2.  It's like nails on a chalkboard hearing "It's just a base game" from the community when sequels aren't supposed to just be more of the same and wait for expansions to get what we've had before.  Name one franchise that asks customers to pay multiple times for things they've had in previous games?  We're not asking for all expansions in one, we're asking for a complete game where the features we've had prior make sense to have from the get-go.   Pool items, band equipment, places to go dating and group hangouts, clothing stores...they should of said "What do we need in a life simulator with a whole living town?"  and no one seemed to ask that question.  Instead it was a list where they threw darts at and that's what got done, leaving a lot of content on the cutting room floor.

Sims 3 was a copy/paste rush job to please EA's suits and shareholders, nothing more.  It's sims 2 slapped in an open hood with a fresh new coat of paint. I feel sorry for the Sims team because I'm sure most of them really want to make a great game for us but are tied down by EA.

[Lorelei]

All eyes are towards simslice then surely 

I have not cast my eyes towards Simslice since TS2 came out and they went pay, so, no, "all" eyes are definitely not on Steve & company at this point.

[edalbformat]

You people have forgotten SIMs 2 base game so quickly.  Majority of the EPs were already in base game it is the expansions which activate them. 

Wrong assumption. The EPs included meshes and original colors. You could not do anything with the base game because meshes were missing. Not true that everything was already in a sack. My group have massively downloaded objects and meshes custom made by several of some dead sites. At every EP we were just confirming that custom contents that were put free for the users were just slightly made up and included in the EPs. So, they were not there, WE put them available, just that normal modders don't have immediate access to ass expensive tools/programs.
The EP that finally included a comprehensive bunch of alternatives to make objects available in game, was Appartment Life. Before this EP you could do nothing with the base game, first because it was too primitive and remained primitive throughout Seasons, BV and all previous crap. Finally as everything was already doggone, they released the pseudo EP Mansions &...
It included nothing that you could not find at MTS2. But it finally released all the coding so that people with a little patience could sew together all the EPs in one (I did, so any tard could do it).

[dilitru]

I would also like to point out that EA stated once that The Sims 3 base game will have weather. If I recall correctly, there was a picture showing rain, with a sim looking up doing the "it's raining!" reaction like the one in TS2.

Wikipedia still shows a shred of this promise:

Every lot is now synchronised with the main neighborhood time. Before, time of day and weather were different in each lot and would continue off from the last time it was played.

Curse those money-hungry executive meddlers.

(Edited many times to keep it short and simple)

[Silver Knight]

Ive been looking around server boards, to share my frustration of this "bullshit" EA is doing, i guess i found another to share my discontent with, im no idle follower of MATY, but it's not half a bad place, good to see someones fixing EA's wrongs with awesome mod i guess.

If you have not signed not signed it already, theres a petition on the offical "Sims 3" forum, to get rid of the store.


What we truely need, in gaming these days, are indie developers, since they are pretty much the way forward for inventive fresh idea's and gameplay, if you don't believe me, look at Mount & Blade or Killing Floor. The sims is a dieing genre as long as EA is in power, and the only person willing to buy EA, is Microsoft which isn't a bad idea (They actually listen to customers) But thats not going to happen sadly, EA are Jackels, take all they can, and laugh.

The game took less than a year to make... they were trying to rush it out pretty fast, but they didn't quite make it, delayed it, snipped out everything, and released it. Some people are also pretty convinced they even leaked their actual game (BETA version) to draw attention to it, just like Spore.

[id]

" theres a petition on the offical "Sims 3" forum, to get rid of the store."

If I'm right, we won't need that fairly soon.  As soon as the modders come out with their own meshes in force, no one is going to even look at the EA store for furniture or clothing.  I would imagine they also KNOW there's an expiration date on the store, they can't be that stupid.  Oh well, in a year or so we'll know.  If one piece of furniture still costs the equivalent of a Dollar (or Euro over here) then we'll know they live in another reality.

The store will go away if no one buys there.  It's that simple.  So if you hate it don't buy. The only thing I've downloaded from the store are free items.  I haven't even spent the original 1000 points that you get to lure you there.  I have gotten a few items here, and a nice windfall that was, but if I hadn't, I simply would do without, period.

[tizerist]

" theres a petition on the offical "Sims 3" forum, to get rid of the store."

Yeah? Someone should do one "We demand an explanation for error 12 and 13's"

[ImpeachSarahPalin]

If you don't buy from the store don't buy from the store, but don't spoil the fun for everybody. For many simmers, the Sim Store is an invaluable service.

[Sigmund]

don't spoil the fun for everybody

Somehow, I think you've stumbled into the wrong forum.

[Darksmurf]

Yeah? Someone should do one "We demand an explanation for error 12 and 13's"

Why have a petition? People all over the world can have a vacation here in California then we can scorch EA