Playing AL without apartments: witches enough?

[Liz]

Given that I prefer to lag at least a couple of months behind when it comes to acquiring/installing the last few EPs, I'm now starting to ponder whether to bother with AL and would appreciate opinions and input. Right off the top I'll say that I have zero interests in playing apartments. I fail to see the point. The social groups stuff also sounds pretty pointless to me. I am quite interested, however, in the witch-y aspect of this EP. So with all the things about this EP that really fail to interest me in any way, how likely do you guys think am I to find the addition of witches to be worth slogging through all the other "features" of AL?

[jolrei]

Speaking as one who has also not played apartments in my "real" hoods (tried it in a test hood), and has only seen the witches once, I like many of the little features and tweaks (new skillinating possibilities, playgrounds and other "stuff", etc.).  I always say I don't care about certain features, but ultimately find that I start using and liking the increased options that a new EP brings along, as I get tired of my old style of gameplay.  I think it's worth having for this reason (although admittedly I arrrquired my copy to avoid paying for securom).

[tizerist]

Theres always the ceilings, spiral stircases, new interactions, hood deco, new items, animations and of course witchkraft.
The apartments are always an option you don't have to include in your game, just like eveything else.

So it would be a neat little EP without apartments anyhow.
No, on second thoughts it would be a crap EP, but the additions to the game are there nonetheless.

[Zazazu]

Short list of non-apartment likes (since I only have one apartment in play anyway):

• Ceilings without having to place tiles manually - Yay!
• Spiral staircases ...better traffic control than Marvine's
• Some of the interactions are cute. My sim kids love jumping rope as part of their fitness learning times. Peek-a-boo is win.
• So many new floors, walls, and fences. I like almost all of them, and I'm pretty anti-EAxis.

Boo:

• Ceilings don't work well with lots you've done some level-lowering with using the constrainfloorelevationcheat. It's pretty bad. Not only does it screw the ceilings on the lower area, but it screws what you see of the roof from the inside.
• Hood deco screw-ups (pond miscategorized, alleys not layerable over lots, building replacement total fail)
• The normal list of bugs. See the borkination thread in Oops.
• Some stupid perk (either reputation or benefit of a great review) giving my sims unavoidable money. It needs to die.

Social groups are pointless. I haven't done the witch stuff much. My only witch is Princess Plum the Infallibly Good Witch. She's more eye-candy right now as her time hasn't come yet.

[Gastfyr]

In my oppinion, the witchyness is pretty cool.

The clothes they get are a beautiful mesh; I love them in both "good" and "evil" colours (havan't actually seen nutral colours yet!).  Someone at MTS2 extracted the female witch clothes and did a pink recolour which I downloaded and have made a couple of my own recolours to.  Witches can learn lots of useful spells, but by far the best one is the teleportation spell wich is free to cast and I think is actually faster than ninja teleport.

Witches can also craft a bunch of stuff.  Probably the most useful to my play style is the ReNuU potion wich wasn't buyable or craftable before AL.  They can also craft all the curing potions as well as the love potion from Nightlife (you have to have the EP each potion came with, though).  They also can craft decorative objects and a set of lamps (well, two sets, one evil and one good; the evil one looks awesome).  Probably the most useful is the chair they can craft wich maxes out all thier motives when they sit in it.  They need to have a huge magic skill to craft it and it takes forever to craft, but once they have one, stick by bookcase or whatever, and they can study while their meters fill up.  Never need to eat, pee, bathe, sleep, or socailze again!  lol

If you have pets they get spectral cats wich are pretty cute.  The cats can't have jobs and can't breed, but they also never need to pee, wich is a cool bonus.  In fact, you never need to feed the specrtal cat either, since it will just unsummon itslef if any of its meters get too low.

Overall, I have enjoyed playing around with the witches.  I eventuall would like to have a "house of freaks" or something with some combination of Witch, Plantsim, Vampire, Zombie, Werewolf, Bigfoot, Servo, and Alien, but I don't like playing more than 5-6 sims in one house, so I think I'd make some of them combinations.  lol  I'm not even sure if Bigfoot can become a witch; can he be a vampire?

As far as the rest of the game goes, I do like a bunch of the other stuff as well.  Social groups are silly, but they do add "tell a story" and 5 new gestures that are useful in building relationshis btwn sims who have little in common because the gestures and "stories" are nearly always accepted.  Peek-a-boo is also very cute.     And jumping rope is quite useful since no skill or object is reqired and it is also fun!  (the irritating thing is they tend to cancel the action as soon as thier fun meter is full.)

I personally really like the new study options.  Anger Management can be very nice for a sim that you want to be nice and lvl headed for instance.  And I havn't seen the usefullness of Fire Safety yet, but it sounds like a good idea in theory...

Overall, I'd say it is worth your time (if not your money).  The unoffical patch available at this site actually makes it playable (I would NOT recomend playing AL without the "patch").

[J. M. Pescado]

I personally really like the new study options.  Anger Management can be very nice for a sim that you want to be nice and lvl headed for instance.  And I havn't seen the usefullness of Fire Safety yet, but it sounds like a good idea in theory...

Anger management is useless because it does not allow a sim to more effectively manage being angry. Better management should allow them to make more use of their rage, not make it go faster! In what school of management does squandering a resource constitute GOOD management?!? Was this idea from the treasury department?

Fire safety is similarly useless, as it does not really improve a sim's reaction to fires. They still scream at it, albeit of slightly reduced duration, and then do nothing useful about it and are quickly back to screaming at it. Firemod makes it more useful, but out of the box, it is as utterly worthless as the the others. There is ONE skill that shines above all others, even with the broken exploit patched, though: Physiology. -20% energy decay!

[Gastfyr]

There is ONE skill that shines above all others, even with the broken exploit patched, though: Physiology. -20% energy decay!

Is that what it does?!  I had one sim learn it a while back and then stopped playing her because she was maxing all skills in a matter of hours; just seemd too easy.  I think I have your fix for that broken exploit now though, so I think I'm gonna teach all my sims Physiology!   

[Dea]

I like how you can move things up and down the wall. 

[jim]

I don't bother with witches, just as vampires or werewolves never appealed to me. The apartment aspect I do find worthwhile, and I've quite a few sims living in apartments now. I like that sims just starting out can afford to live somewhere with decent facilities by just renting.  I also get sims who were friends as kids, went off to uni together etc. to move into the same block when they're adults, so they get to socialize haphazardly in common areas without my needing to manage them.

[Eva Aisling]

The witches are fun, but seem to take a bit too much devotion for casual use. There is a hack to cast without reagents, though. Making the reagents is a bit tedious after a while, but you can also just buy them if you have the simoleons.
Even if there weren't witches, I would definitely still get the EP. No question. There are a ton of small features that add up to a really great expansion. Moving pictures up and down, potrait automatically changing when you change outfit, the new skills to research, playground equipment, etc. And remember, apartments come in REAL handy when you move a sim out into the family bin and he doesn't have enough simoleons to buy a house.
Despite a few complaints (*cough* no beach apartments*cough*), I am definitely satisfied with this EP...and I've barely fooled around with witches yet.

[J. M. Pescado]

Even if there weren't witches, I would definitely still get the EP. No question. There are a ton of small features that add up to a really great expansion. Moving pictures up and down, potrait automatically changing when you change outfit, the new skills to research, playground equipment, etc. And remember, apartments come in REAL handy when you move a sim out into the family bin and he doesn't have enough simoleons to buy a house.

That's not a good thing! That's a BAD thing, a really goddamn ANNOYING and LAGGY thing. EAxis could have trivially implemented this in a non-horrifically-laggy way with a simple BHAV line, but NOOOO, they had to COMPLETELY BUGGER IT UP.

[Slymenstra]

I also waited a while to get AL.  So far I do like the witches, I am not ususally into the other "species" of the game.  I got some hacks/mods to take away the skin change and sparkles.  I have always made duplexes and apartments using Inge's lockable doors so I am enjoying apartments.  I like the new interactions and even the statue man and the breakdancer.

I hate the changing of the portrait...to see its total fail, watch someone get electrocuted!  As always they tend to get obsessed over the new items and jumping rope.

So my hack folder is even bigger but I love a lot of the items added and I am really liking the game right now.

[Mootilda]

Despite a few complaints (*cough* no beach apartments*cough*), I am definitely satisfied with this EP...and I've barely fooled around with witches yet.

Here's a fix for beach apartments:
http://www.modthesims2.com/showthread.php?t=302405

[Ruann]

If it were just Witches, then no it wouldn't be enough.  But Witches + Reputation + new objects and socials make it worth the effort.  I'm not a huge Apartment fan, I think they could be much better implemented, but that's not a big loss.

[J. M. Pescado]

I haven't really seen this reputation thing much at work, other than that random sims decide to give you things for no reason while your reputation is still 0.

[Zazazu]

At certain rep levels, you can get discounts on buy mode objects, random blind dates if not married, or a "prototype" to test...always a tv for me. You also can be offered a job at a higher level than the newspaper gives. The only bad rep result I've seen caused higher prices on buy mode objects. Most of my sims are nice. According to IGN, it says that the rep bar level affects your starting relationships with people. However, it says that's the only affect, which is patently false. They say that the benefits are a result of befriending sims in social groups. My one 'hood has no social group sims and I've gotten the benefits. Lies.

And there's that dumb salary thing I need to catch a screen shot of. I want it dead. I had thought it was purely a rep thing, but now I think it has to do with owning a business, since both times I've gotten it it was while I was running a business and the receiver was the owner. You can't zero it out or cancel it out, and the lowest amount is $5/hour.

[Cappuccino]

I also really hate the good vs evil alignment thing. The more "good" you are the less spells you can cast on the evil side and vice versa. I would like to see a mod to remove this restriction (I'm thinking someone will make one like that eventually).

Someone (TripleM) already has made that. Check the Peasantry.

ETA: Gah, I'm feeling extra helpful today: http://www.moreawesomethanyou.com/smf/index.php/topic,12918.0.html

[coralleane]

At certain rep levels, you can get discounts on buy mode objects, random blind dates if not married, or a "prototype" to test...always a tv for me. You also can be offered a job at a higher level than the newspaper gives. The only bad rep result I've seen caused higher prices on buy mode objects. Most of my sims are nice. According to IGN, it says that the rep bar level affects your starting relationships with people. However, it says that's the only affect, which is patently false. They say that the benefits are a result of befriending sims in social groups. My one 'hood has no social group sims and I've gotten the benefits. Lies.

And there's that dumb salary thing I need to catch a screen shot of. I want it dead. I had thought it was purely a rep thing, but now I think it has to do with owning a business, since both times I've gotten it it was while I was running a business and the receiver was the owner. You can't zero it out or cancel it out, and the lowest amount is $5/hour.

Salary thing?  I've had a few Sims get the "Wow, I'm in the same career as you, I think you should get better wages!" benefit.  I agree that it doesn't seem to actually require social group townies at all - a couple of the benefits have come from standard townies IIRC, and the reputation increase is with anyone on a community lot.. so my business owner had max reputation incredibly quickly, as does anyone who goes out on a date or two to a comm lot. 

Apparently the prototype can be a TV or a computer - I seem to mostly get the computer, but I've had one or two TV's as well. Another benefit/penalty is lower/higher rent if your Sim lives in an apartment.. apparently promotions/demotions as well, but I've not seen this yet. 

Edited to Add:

..on the original topic - I'm not really using apartments much, and I only have one witch, and I still rather like the expansion pack overall.  The little things that have been mentioned above, such as the ability to move items up/down walls, spiral staircases, ceilings (I use a minimum of CC so never bothered with custom versions of ceilings/stairs), skipping, the new playground stuff (some of which builds body skill - always useful!) and so on are things that can make the pack worthwhile even without the main draws. 

[VacantBlue]

Can't say much about a good reputation yet, but I have one Sim who has a bad rep.  When she meets a Sim, her relationship both lifetime and daily are immediately negative.  Also, while not directly interacting, other Sims make a goofy noise and walk away from her like they are scared of her.

[Gwill]

...random blind dates if not married...

I'm sure I had a married sim get an offer of a blind date.  It rather surprised me.

[spaceface]

Blind date offers are not coded to only happen to unmarried sims. I read about this before, so wasn't surprised when it happened to a married, elder sim. 

[jsalemi]

...random blind dates if not married...

I'm sure I had a married sim get an offer of a blind date.  It rather surprised me.

Yea, I've had married sims get offered blind dates, too.  Guess it includes initiation into the Sim Cheaters Club.

I've seen the results of a bad reputation -- everyone the sim encounters picks on them.  The townies either want to poke or yell at the sim with the bad rep.  And it really spirals out of control on its own.  One sim (Jess Peterson in Desiderata) started getting a bad rep because one of the other trailer park residents took an instant dislike to her and started picking on her, so they got into a fight. Her rep was down to maybe the first tick in the red.  I then sent her to one of the community parks to earn some money and creativity skill, and while she was playing, sims would tip her, then wait to greet her - at one point she had 3 or 4 'greet' icons stacked up in her queue.  Because she didn't stop playing to greet them, their queues turned to stuff like 'yell at', and when she finally stopped playing, she got yelled at or poked by every townie in the park.

By the time she got home, her rep was pure red, and now every sim she meets wants to annoy/yell at/poke/slap her.  

[dragoness]

Yea, I've had married sims get offered blind dates, too.  Guess it includes initiation into the Sim Cheaters Club.

I've seen the results of a bad reputation -- everyone the sim encounters picks on them.  The townies either want to poke or yell at the sim with the bad rep.  And it really spirals out of control on its own.  One sim (Jess Peterson in Desiderata) started getting a bad rep because one of the other trailer park residents took an instant dislike to her and started picking on her, so they got into a fight. Her rep was down to maybe the first tick in the red.  I then sent her to one of the community parks to earn some money and creativity skill, and while she was playing, sims would tip her, then wait to greet her - at one point she had 3 or 4 'greet' icons stacked up in her queue.  Because she didn't stop playing to greet them, their queues turned to stuff like 'yell at', and when she finally stopped playing, she got yelled at or poked by every townie in the park.

By the time she got home, her rep was pure red, and now every sim she meets wants to annoy/yell at/poke/slap her.  

I'm a big meanypants for being thrilled about that. My sims always tend to be nice, even the ones who hate each other in my games rarely get into fights. (Just poke-weep-poke-weep loops.) So I'm gonna love seeing a bit more antagonism going around on comm lots, and sims reacting to that one guy who loves poking people and ventrilofarting.

[Zazazu]

At certain rep levels, you can get discounts on buy mode objects, random blind dates if not married, or a "prototype" to test...always a tv for me. You also can be offered a job at a higher level than the newspaper gives. The only bad rep result I've seen caused higher prices on buy mode objects. Most of my sims are nice. According to IGN, it says that the rep bar level affects your starting relationships with people. However, it says that's the only affect, which is patently false. They say that the benefits are a result of befriending sims in social groups. My one 'hood has no social group sims and I've gotten the benefits. Lies.

And there's that dumb salary thing I need to catch a screen shot of. I want it dead. I had thought it was purely a rep thing, but now I think it has to do with owning a business, since both times I've gotten it it was while I was running a business and the receiver was the owner. You can't zero it out or cancel it out, and the lowest amount is $5/hour.

Salary thing?  I've had a few Sims get the "Wow, I'm in the same career as you, I think you should get better wages!" benefit.  I agree that it doesn't seem to actually require social group townies at all - a couple of the benefits have come from standard townies IIRC, and the reputation increase is with anyone on a community lot.. so my business owner had max reputation incredibly quickly, as does anyone who goes out on a date or two to a comm lot. 

I know what you are talking about, but this isn't the same thing. None of my sims in Onoway have regular careers...they are all currently OFB business owners. No employees. The business owners are the ones who are getting the dialog. It looks like the one you get to set prices on items, but the lowest you can go is $5. Then, your sim receives $5/hour (or whatever you've chosen). You cannot cancel out of it. There isn't any additional dialog, so I can't tell who is giving the "benefit".

...random blind dates if not married...

I'm sure I had a married sim get an offer of a blind date.  It rather surprised me.

I haven't had a married sim offered, so I assumed. I had a sim offered a blind date by his fiance, though. That was nasty.

By the time she got home, her rep was pure red, and now every sim she meets wants to annoy/yell at/poke/slap her.  

I'm a big meanypants for being thrilled about that. My sims always tend to be nice, even the ones who hate each other in my games rarely get into fights. (Just poke-weep-poke-weep loops.) So I'm gonna love seeing a bit more antagonism going around on comm lots, and sims reacting to that one guy who loves poking people and ventrilofarting.

Gah, I'd love that. All my current sims are nice.

[J. M. Pescado]

w00t. MOAR FIGHT!