Enemies Accumulate and Fight Club with Nightlife

[Motoki]

Is it a good idea to use these with Nightlife? Quite frankly, since Nightlife I now have more than my share of fights and enemies already. I'm not even sure what enemies accumulate does exactly since Rennie nuked the threads at VS and there's no thread on it here. The rtfm is basically just like 'Thank you Draxila, can cause halatosis' etc. 

And wasn't fight club the one that made fights an infinite loop until you cancel it? I don't recall if it will do this for townies since I didn't really have lots of townie fights pre-NL, but if it does that could be a problem.

[Ruann]

Fightclub made fights do more than just a Body check.  It's not an infinite loop, but it may take a while.  Of course, a normal fight can as well.

[Brynne]

I thought fight club made them build fighting skill or something, and make them more likely to win the more fights they had. Maybe that was just a dream I had. I'm terribly sorry for that first awkward sentence.

[J. M. Pescado]

Is it a good idea to use these with Nightlife? Quite frankly, since Nightlife I now have more than my share of fights and enemies already. I'm not even sure what enemies accumulate does exactly since Rennie nuked the threads at VS and there's no thread on it here. The rtfm is basically just like 'Thank you Draxila, can cause halatosis' etc. 

It alters relationship decay slightly, making it so enemies will accumulate rather than disappear if you don't see each other for a bit, and moves relationship decay to a more sane hour instead of "we all hate you now". Also adds a slight offset to relationship loss so it's not an immediate mass scramble at the decay hour to get things patched before they all hate you now, and generally makes it less hectic and messy (although it doesn't really make things easier!).

And wasn't fight club the one that made fights an infinite loop until you cancel it? I don't recall if it will do this for townies since I didn't really have lots of townie fights pre-NL, but if it does that could be a problem.

Fights aren't infinite, but instead of the results of a fight being ignored, so you could see a sim winning the entire fight and then suddenly lose for no obvious reason, the fight rules are changed so that a certain number of randomly determined victories must be achieved in rounds. How it works is that every round, you will see the fight loop play, and whichever sim appears to be winning will gain an increasing advantage in the next round. The advantage will accumulate until the requisite number of victories is achieved, or the losing sim manages to make a comeback, which resets the advantage back to 0. The victor in a fight is the sim which achieves a certain preset number of victories over and above that of his opponent. So if the randomly determined count is 5, then the winning sim must win 5 rounds more than the loser.

If the sims are evenly matched, it will be bloody and long, but the advantage shift will tend to bring things to a closer sooner than pure randomwalk. Grouchy sims will enjoy fighting, though. Fighting is fun for them.

[Mister Roboto]

I've had townies fight in Night clubs before... out to eat... the park, dorms etc.  I do have the fight club mod in place, and they go on for quite awhile, but if you try to interact with them, they'll stop fightnig and a victor will be determined.

[Ancient Sim]

So can we use it with Nightlife as is, or do we have to wait for a new version?

[Motoki]

Enemies accumulate is okay to use with Nightlife according to Dr. Boris' list. Fight Club actually has an updated version for NL, you can get it here:

http://www.moreawesomethanyou.com/ffs/nl/hacks/

I have to say though I may have discovered a sort of bug with fight club. My sims got robbed today and the burglar stole not one but two cars (and they were both the expensive sports car too). The cop did catch up to the burglar and got into a fight with her and won but then instead of what normall happens, the cop taking the burglar to the cop car and going over to your sim to let them know, the burglar took off and the cop just got up and walked into her car and drove off without saying a thing. Normally they come back and talk to you either way.

I am using Dizzy's burglar every 7 days hack so I suppose it could be a conflict with that, but that one was working just fine with NL and all my other NL compatible hacks until I put Fight Club in.

[MokeyHokey]

Hmm, I've had two burglars in the last 24 hours--more than I've had total since I bought the original game --both times, the cop nabbed the burglar after the fight and reported to my sim as usual.

Incidentally, I read that the burglar puts the car in his bag instead of driving off.  Wonder if some enterprising individual could make the burglar DRIVE off in the car. 


Edit: Forgot to mention that I do in fact have the fight club installed, but not Dizzy's burglar hack.

[Motoki]

Hmm, it could be a conflict between the 2 then I suppose, or just some wierdness or my bad luck. :p

I didn't have a car alarm installed so that may have had something to do with it  I suppose and yes she did put them in her bag lol. I've never had a car stolen before so I suppose it could just be some weird Maxis bug or even a "feature" but doesn't make much sense to me. If the cop kicked the burglar's ass then she shouldn't have gotten away and the cop should have said something either way. 

[gynarchy]

I've had the burglar get away after getting his ass kicked by the cop too, but it was with just Uni. I attributed it to my Sim blocking the path to the door, which somehow interrupted the put-bad-guy-in-car sequence. The cop didn't come back to report to my Sim and he didn't receive a memory marker for it either so I just let it go.

[Ancient Sim]

Enemies accumulate is okay to use with Nightlife according to Dr. Boris' list. Fight Club actually has an updated version for NL, you can get it here:

http://www.moreawesomethanyou.com/ffs/nl/hacks/

Thanks vm for the link, didn't realise anything had been updated yet.  Having read the RTFM (which I have just had a blinding flash as to what RTFM stands for ... duh, I can be so SLOW sometimes) ... where was I?  Oh yes, having read the ****ing manual (am I right?), I am wondering about a few things.

I have noticed that all the fights I've had downtown (and there have been quite a few) have been won by the Sim with the most body skill. best fitness and highest Active level.  Only when these have been very siimilar have there been different victors when there have been two fights (which there often are).with the higher Sim winning the first one.  Townies have never won a fight until today, when Komei Tellerman beat one of my Sims.  My Sim was on the border between fit & average (just into fit, but only just), whereas Komei is almost fully-fit.  He also has more body points than my Sim (5 compared to 3).  The reason for this is that I have been using the visitor enabled punchbag and assault courses (although not since Uni) and I think Komei has been taking advantage of them.  Komei is the first of the 'old' townies to have a fight, so all the others have started with the usual mid-range fitness.  Two old townies fought each other yesterday (Sandy Bruty & Melissa Fancey, presumably over some woman as they're both raving lesbians AND they fancy each other like crazy) and in both cases the winner was Sandy, who had the highest overall 'score' with the three things I mentioned.

I am therefore wondering whether the game is now taking body skill, fitness and maybe also Active points into account?  If so, what effect (if any) will the mod have on the in-game calculations?  I haven't seen many fights before NL, but I can definitely see a difference in them now.  They last a LOT longer, for a start. 

[J. M. Pescado]

Lengthy fights is generally a sign that your combatants are evenly matched. The "Standard" fight rules basically just give you a 50/50 shot with basically zero correlation to what you see, making it kind of pointless to spectate the fight. The "modified" fight rules keep score, where your fight score is a running tally of who wins: Instead of a fight lasting an arbitrary random number of rounds, one combatant must gain an arbitrary number of victories. So now you can actually watch the progress of the fight: Generally, by the animations, it's clear who has the upper hand, and you can actually see his advantage grow as he wins more consecutive rounds, or the other combatant make a comeback. It's much more nail-biting and intense now. Previously, watching it was pointless since what you saw had no real correlation to the outcome, nor did Body skill have a significant effect on the outcome unless you had 10 and he had 0.

[Brynne]

If I may go off on a tangent, here, I had an adult attack a child the other day. I have never seen that happen before this EP. It actually went on for a decent amount of time, (although the animations were a little screwy. The adult female was doing all the normal fighting moves while the child just stood still in the middle of the "cloud".) then the child had a dialogue box pop up that said something like "I can see you're not a sim to be trifled with, so I'll just stay out of your way." A little kid!I've seen teens and adults go at it- one of my teen boys is constantly beating up his mother (there's a hallmark card moment for ya). Is this new with NL?

[Motoki]

I've had the burglar get away after getting his ass kicked by the cop too, but it was with just Uni. I attributed it to my Sim blocking the path to the door, which somehow interrupted the put-bad-guy-in-car sequence. The cop didn't come back to report to my Sim and he didn't receive a memory marker for it either so I just let it go.

Well in my case they got into a fight outside and the ground was perfectly level. There was no junk outside either so I can't imagine what could have blocked her path. I guess it's just another quirk in the game. I'll have to see if it happens again or if installing car alarms help.

[J. M. Pescado]

If I may go off on a tangent, here, I had an adult attack a child the other day. I have never seen that happen before this EP. It actually went on for a decent amount of time, (although the animations were a little screwy. The adult female was doing all the normal fighting moves while the child just stood still in the middle of the "cloud".) then the child had a dialogue box pop up that said something like "I can see you're not a sim to be trifled with, so I'll just stay out of your way." A little kid!I've seen teens and adults go at it- one of my teen boys is constantly beating up his mother (there's a hallmark card moment for ya). Is this new with NL?

Sounds like there's more cases that have to be accounted for in The Fight Club now.

[Ancient Sim]

I am wondering whether certain NPC's are exempt from the Fight Mod as it stands.  One of my Sims with a long-standing grievance with the cow mascot (now a playable Sim but still with the same character and status, because it keeps coming back whenever I alter it) attacked her in the Crypt o' Wotsit Nightclub tonight.  He should have won easily - he has 9 Body points, almost full fitness, 10 logic, 10 Creativity and high points everywhere else (except cleaning).  She has 5 body points and is on the verge of going below average in fitness.  She only has 5 or 6 logic points.  The fight didn't last all that long and the cow mascot won it.  Earlier, she'd beaten Erik Swain who also has more points and fitness than her, but I didn't see that one (I fell asleep and missed it!). 

Incidentally, do temporal things like energy and hunger affect the outcome?  I haven't seen it mentioned that they do, but if so it could explain why my Sim lost as he only had about 25% energy left when he started the fight.

[J. M. Pescado]

Is the cow an experienced battle veteran? If you routinely assault the cow, it will gain lots of combat experience from all the fighting. In addition to skills having an effect, combat experience provides a percentile bonus to it, so that a veteran of many battles will outperform even somebody with considerably more body skill.

Since NPCs are basically immortal, the cow may remember generations of fighting. As an ancient warrior, he will thus outperform his body skill. Also, when the cow fights the cheerleader and mascot, he will gain battle experience from that, too. You probably won't notice the effect if only the cheerleaders and mascots fight the cow, because both the mascot/cheerleader and the cow will gain combat experience simultaneously, only victories are more valuable than defeats. Thus, the cow will continue to lose more and more to the cheerleaders and mascots, but will be able to defeat your own sims, who are not seasoned warriors. Perhaps your sims need to gain more actual combat experience before taking on tough, veteran warriors like the mighty cow.

[reggikko]

Well in my case they got into a fight outside and the ground was perfectly level. There was no junk outside either so I can't imagine what could have blocked her path. I guess it's just another quirk in the game. I'll have to see if it happens again or if installing car alarms help.

A car alarm completely prevents the burglar from stealing the car. I love the new "Furious at the burglar" state. But it seems they have removed the option to free the burglar.

[Motoki]

A car alarm completely prevents the burglar from stealing the car. I love the new "Furious at the burglar" state. But it seems they have removed the option to free the burglar.

I've noticed this too, so we now can't free the burglar, although even if they did they'd probably just kick his ass since they are furious at him, and since they get furious at him, they know him and are able to call him.

Cops, btw, have been unable to be interacted with since Uni, which I find annoying since there seems to be no legitimate way to meet them now. When I make them selectable via a cheat, it revealed that they seem to have a bazillion instances of leave the lot queued up indefinitely now. Prior to Uni, I had my sims meet several cops and even married one.

[breyerii]

Is the cow an experienced battle veteran? If you routinely assault the cow, it will gain lots of combat experience from all the fighting. In addition to skills having an effect, combat experience provides a percentile bonus to it, so that a veteran of many battles will outperform even somebody with considerably more body skill.

Since NPCs are basically immortal, the cow may remember generations of fighting. As an ancient warrior, he will thus outperform his body skill. Also, when the cow fights the cheerleader and mascot, he will gain battle experience from that, too. You probably won't notice the effect if only the cheerleaders and mascots fight the cow, because both the mascot/cheerleader and the cow will gain combat experience simultaneously, only victories are more valuable than defeats. Thus, the cow will continue to lose more and more to the cheerleaders and mascots, but will be able to defeat your own sims, who are not seasoned warriors. Perhaps your sims need to gain more actual combat experience before taking on tough, veteran warriors like the mighty cow.

Question: since being moved in erases all memory NPC's have, is their fighting experience removed as well?

[Oddysey]

A car alarm completely prevents the burglar from stealing the car. I love the new "Furious at the burglar" state. But it seems they have removed the option to free the burglar.

I've noticed this too, so we now can't free the burglar, although even if they did they'd probably just kick his ass since they are furious at him, and since they get furious at him, they know him and are able to call him.

Cops, btw, have been unable to be interacted with since Uni, which I find annoying since there seems to be no legitimate way to meet them now. When I make them selectable via a cheat, it revealed that they seem to have a bazillion instances of leave the lot queued up indefinitely now. Prior to Uni, I had my sims meet several cops and even married one.

I had a sim get a burglar as a blind date. Probably applies to cops as well.

[Motoki]

I wonder if they can even get drivers. I know my sims sometimes bring them over as friends which is a pain because you can't interact with them.