Jealousy/memory question (and perhaps request)

[moniquinin]

I was wondering if it's possible/feasible to "fix" something that's been annoying me for ages which I find simply stupid and unrealistic.  And if it is, and of interest to someone here who is much more awesome than me, to do something about it.

I hate the fact that flirting with someone when romantically attached to another sim is considered having an affair, especially if their relationship score is really low.  In fact, there should be a difference between "cheating" and "having an affair" based on relationship score, but I imagine creating new memories and all that is much more involved.  Anyway, is there a way to tweak this so that these memories are created only by, for example, woohooing only?  Basically, I want a couple of my sims to be big flirts and not screw up their relationships.  And yes, I do modify jealousy using ACR, but the "had an affair with so and so" memory is still generated.

[Marhis]

Your idea shouldn't be too difficult to realize, per se; the main problem, I think, might be the fact that usually jealousy is handled in global ways, and there are many other mod that alter that behavior in many ways, so one should eventually consider their effects too.

In this moment I'm working on a mod that allows sims to have marriages "of convenience" (i.e. even if enemies or with low relationship score) and polygamy as well. One of my problems is the same jealousy handling, and unfortunately it's not so easy to decide how to handle it.

[Lorelei]

On the whole, the jealousy in Sims is ridiculous. As is the three bolt "wanting to be INSIDE YOUR SKIN AT ALL TIMES" hovering. Gah. It's coded-in stalker love.

I agree, it's got to be possible to tweak jealousy so only actual intimacy triggers freak-outs. A peck on the cheek, dancing, playing childish games, a friendly hug, admiring and talking about interests or asking questions...none of these things constitutes cheating. Slow dancing, making out, woohooing, romantic kisses or hugs, wolf whistling, etc., if the jealous Sim is actually going steady with / engaged to / married to the offending Sim...those I could understand.

Also, someone made an apology hack that causes the offended Sim to be angry at the instigator, as should be. Getting pissed at your mate because some horndog or floozy insisted on trying to woo them? Silly.

[twojeffs]

The 'had affair' memories are not easily dealt with. At least not to selectively nuke them for flirts or some other specific interaction due to the way (and where in the code) they are generated. I thought I had a solution a few months ago but it turned out my idea wouldn't work. I haven't given up on it though, I've always hated the way those memories work. It's dumb and not realistic at all.

[Marhis]

The 'had affair' memories are not easily dealt with. At least not to selectively nuke them for flirts or some other specific interaction due to the way (and where in the code) they are generated.

It's that damn "type of social" check? That, and the crush/love checks involved seems a big mess to me (well, anything a bit more than basic in BHAVs seems a mess to me, but still).

[moniquinin]

Hey TJ, I was hoping you'd respond to this post.  I thought this might be right up your alley and was interested in your thoughts.  I wish I knew more about how the game works and its programming because this one (and teens pissing off their parents and getting a hit on their relationship for having sex) is one I would LOVE to see in the game.  I thought that maybe for the teen thing, it could somehow be done through the spy on neighbor through telescope thing, the way old guy Goth crosses the whole neighborhood to slap you around.  But then again, I have no idea what I'm talking about and am basically talking out my ass 

Also, someone made an apology hack that causes the offended Sim to be angry at the instigator, as should be. Getting pissed at your mate because some horndog or floozy insisted on trying to woo them? Silly.

I know, it's crap.  Does this always happen though?  Even if the person refuses the flirt?  Also, is this hack still around/supported and is it awesome (or close to)?

[Karen]

Also, someone made an apology hack that causes the offended Sim to be angry at the instigator, as should be. Getting pissed at your mate because some horndog or floozy insisted on trying to woo them? Silly.

I know, it's crap.  Does this always happen though?  Even if the person refuses the flirt?  Also, is this hack still around/supported and is it awesome (or close to)?

The apologize fix is in Peasantry, here: http://www.moreawesomethanyou.com/smf/index.php/topic,2467.0.html  I don't know if it's Seasons-compatible, though.

[moniquinin]

Thanks Karen.  I've read through the thread and I have a question which I'm not sure I should post since it would be total necromancy.  But maybe you could help.  Sybespunk states that the instigator of the bad behaviour is who the "victim" will be furious with.  So to be clear, this means, as described by you, that the game doesn't consider being flirted with as a furious-provoking act with this mod?

I always found it rather odd that if someone was caught cheating, both parties apologised to eachother, but then after thinking about it, it made sense because on has to apologise for cheating and the other for assaulting.  What I later realised was that the person who was slapped wasn't furious at the person who slapped them which is just plain wrong.  I think that the apology action should only show up when someone is furious at them, it should have a major effect on the time it takes to make up, and and it's what actually causes furiousness that should be addressed, which takes us back to my original question - plain, harmless flirting should not make anyone furious at their mate and should make them want to slap them, unless they're an EXTREMELY jealous type.

[syberspunk]

Thanks Karen.  I've read through the thread and I have a question which I'm not sure I should post since it would be total necromancy.  But maybe you could help.  Sybespunk states that the instigator of the bad behaviour is who the "victim" will be furious with.  So to be clear, this means, as described by you, that the game doesn't consider being flirted with as a furious-provoking act with this mod?

I am not quite sure... but I don't think furiousness always accompanies jealousy. Then again... I do have a hack from DJSims that results in less furiousness.  I should probably take that out to "spice" my game up, along with nopuddlerage. Hehehe.

In my experience, I had a few couples where one sim caught the other cheating and did not get furious. They did haul ass over to the other sim and proceeded to slap them, causing the other sim (the one who was doing the cheating) to be furious with them (the one who was cheated on ).  So, the slapping part worked as you described below (at least for me).  What I think is retardo, is that the cheatee was not furious with the cheater.  But as I said, I do have that less furious hack, so... that could be why.

I always found it rather odd that if someone was caught cheating, both parties apologised to eachother, but then after thinking about it, it made sense because on has to apologise for cheating and the other for assaulting.  What I later realised was that the person who was slapped wasn't furious at the person who slapped them which is just plain wrong.  I think that the apology action should only show up when someone is furious at them, it should have a major effect on the time it takes to make up, and and it's what actually causes furiousness that should be addressed, which takes us back to my original question - plain, harmless flirting should not make anyone furious at their mate and should make them want to slap them, unless they're an EXTREMELY jealous type.

I changed the test BHAV so it should work as you described in that... if a sim (that you click on) is upset with the sim you are controlling (currently selected), the apologize option should appear, and not the backasswards way Maxis had.  This should also include the situation where a sim might be furious.  The one who is furious shouldn't be apologizing to the one who made them furious (unless they made each other furious at each other... ).  Anyhew, hope that makes sense.

Maybe, if I find the time, I'll dig into the code and see whether jealousy inducing events also cause furiousness.  To me, I think it should, at least possibly based on personality, asp, and mood.  It would seem very odd that it didn't (cause both jealousy and furiousness that is).

Ste