More Awesome Than You!

OK.  I've searched for this and found nothing that exactly matches the troubles I'm having right now.  If any awesome person can offer some help or advice or even just ranting rights ... please.

I installed a dashing new NVidia GE Force 7600 graphics card about a month ago.  From that moment on I've been able to load and play Sims 2 perfectly for 40 minutes and no more.  At the magic witching hour, the screen goes black and I can do exactly nothing but pull the plug on the whole PC.

I have downloaded and installed/uninstalled/reinstalled more drivers, soundcard updates, directx versions than I can remember or wish to think about.  I have uninstalled my game and reinstalled my game (I feel like Eeyore and his balloon at this point).  I have removed every download and replaced everything one tiny piece at a time.  I've been in contact with EA who were communicative but ultimately unhelpful.  Nothing makes any difference.

I've removed the side of my PC and blown fans at it.  Banned cats from the room, hoovered madly and now I've run out of ideas and given up.  If anyone has any bright ideas that don't involve sledgehammers (my current favoured option) could you let me know?

I have all expansions, but no stuff packs.

 :-\ How much memory and what processor does your computer have ?  :-\

Could it be the drivers for your card?

My game used to hate the (then) newest drivers for my ATI card, causing everything to freeze after 20-30 minutes of play. I got an old version of an Omega driver which I use to this day and never had a problem.

I have an ATI card though, and know absolutely nothing about these things so you shouldn't pay too much attention to me, I'm probably just trying to confuse you :P

I have that card (the 7600) and run problem free. Not very helpful am I  :P Seiously though, when I had it installed I ran a defrag and then reinstalled the game. Which it seems you have done.
I have a Pentium 4 3.2ghz with 1 gig Ram and am using the 91.31 drivers.
Possibly the only thing I am doing differently to most is that the machine I use for simming is not connected to the internet, so I have no antivirus running in the background. I do remember being unable to install Uni on the family machine until my Norton's was turned off.
So my winning formula is 1gig ram, 91.31 driver and no anti virus  :) If you have tried all this then I guess we have to wait for a tech expert.....I'm sure one will show up soon.
Have you seen this http://www.moreawesomethanyou.com/smf/index.php/topic,5832.0.html it is about a different card but has a driver cleaner link and another driver link that might be of interest.

Is it just Sims2 that causes the problem? Or does any game that is processor/graphics intensive result in the same blackout?
My only experiences of this have been hardware temperature related - I've seen both CPUs and graphics cards overheat to the point where the screen blacks out. Check out the nVidia website forum and their support - I think they have a temperature monitoring feature built into their drivers. You might need to run the game windowed (add -w to the shortcut command line) so that you can keep an eye on the temperature monitor. This should give you a pretty quick answer as to whether it's an overheating problem.
Another thing to consider, is whether the PSU on you computer can provide enough power - check the wattage rating compared to the requirements of your new graphics card versus your old graphics card. You might need to upgrade the PSU as well if it can't supply enough oomph to power the entire system (including fans) properly.

I actually experience a somewhat similar problem, though it's not clockwork like yours. Sometimes I can play for hours upon hours without a problem, and sometimes it'll freeze up 30 minutes in. I've gotten into the habit of saving regularly.

What happens is that everything on screen will freeze, but I can still hear the sounds. Then a moment later, the screen will go black, then that Sims blue. I'll get the Sims hourglass turning and everything will pretty much be frozen. Occasionally I'll get the error noise. Once in a great while, I'll get an error about the display adapters that vanishes too quick to be fully read. The only solution is to hold in the power button and shut it off, waite five seconds, and start again.

Sims2 is the heaviest graphic game I play right now, so I don't know if this would do it with anything else. Neverwinter Nights 1 runs just fine.

Mine does the same as Orikes....see the other threads.
I wish I had a solution for you, Mrs. H., but "saving frequently" (as in every sims 1/2 hour) is the best I've come up with. Strangely, this didn't happen with my old crappy card & driver. I upgraded because it couldn't handle OFB. *sighs and shrugs*

Try putting the old card back?

As strange as it sounds, I'd rather deal with the BlackSODs than the old card of crappola.

I has a similar problem. The game would minimize to the desktop after about 20 mins... almost every 20 mins... I gradually figured out it was my power management settings.

So, i opened up my control panel, went to the power settings and saw that my monitor was configured to turn off after 20 mins... so, i turned off all my power settings, hibernation, standby, etc. and chose "never" for my hardware settings. Fixed my problem.

Even though the monitor wasn't going off and i was playing the game, the stupid pooter had a mind of it's own. Take a look at your power settings and change everything to "never" and then play the game.... if that helps your problem, turn it all back on and see if the prob comes back...

just a thought....good luck :)

Had problems with my NVIDIA card as well; except I'd get a blue screen.  Tried everything, including updating drivers, back-dating them, adding more RAM.  Eventually came across some threads in various forums where others were having issues with some series of NVIDIA cards (Maxis actually quietly removed some of them from their "ok" list that had originally been given the green light.)....Finally, bit the bullet and bought a Radeon, and have not had a single problem since. THe issue disappeared immeidately.

I've considered that, but I just got this card (and whole 'puter) back in April and I really need to deal with my car situation before I consider throwing more money at my computer. It's a frustrating situation, but the 'crash' isn't frequent enough to give me too much grief at this point. I can deal with saving regularly and just rebooting after the crash as long as I get a good chunk of play time in between crashes. I finally gave up on my old computer when I couldn't even play NWN for five minutes without it crashing.

Try eBaying it.

Are the problem cards primarily nVidia?

I recently installed an ATI Radeon X850XT - plus a second card fan - system runs beautifully.  Never did had problems with the first one either though (also an ATI).

MrsH, have you contacted nVidia about the problem?

there is a huge problem with nvidia cards post OFB

see here:
http://modthesims2.com/showthread.php?goto=lastpost&t=117748

After screwing with this for 7 months, I bought an ATI. I tried asking nvidia at their forums -- 5 weeks and no response, status is "researching."

those cards have a habit of doing that, try buying a new one.  I think its an overheating problem

Thank you so much for the replies.  At least I'm not alone.

I have an Intel Pentium 4 CPU 3.20Ghz processor, with 1024 RAM so in theory it should run my entire house without blinking. 

The black screen thingyness doesn't affect anything else at all - not even my beloved point and click graphics heavy adventures (I'm an old-fashioned girl - I love my point and clicks - they are why I shelled out for the new card in the first place). 

I'm thinking at this point that it probably is some kind of overheating problem, but I'm blowed if I know how to solve it.  Short of deep freezing, I can't see much I can do to cool it down.

NVidia have indeed been contacted (at length) and haven't been able to solve it.

For the time being I'll stick to the "save after every sim shower" method that's become my best friend and routine driver updates.  It's true that at least the BSOD is marginally less annoying than random flops to desktop but not by very much.

Orikes, I get the same problem, but mine's because I'm playing on a laptop. A little note hidden somewhere in the readme says the game may or may not work with laptop video cards - so basically my computer's allergic to the Sims. And many no-cd cracks for other games, too. Saving every sim-day seems to be the only solution.

Don't mean to be the voice of doom and gloom, but I tried all the fixes for overheating (that's one of the things that was suggested to me); went as far as to buy a floor standing fan, take the side of my cpu and have the fan aimed at the inside.  I also found the blank screen problem began to crop up more frequently.  But hey, I'm glad you've found a work-around.

I was able to sell my NVIDIA to a friend.  It gave no problems with other games; it was just TS2 (after I installed OFB).  I was a firm believer in NVIDIA, but after I invested in a Radeon, I was astounded at the quality of the graphics in TS2.  I had no idea the water (ponds and pools) was so amazingly reflective!  Certainly 'more awesome' (lame pun intended)

Out of curiosity, what Radeon card did you get? Or, what non Nvidia cards do people recommend?

Plop.  This is not sounding good for my NVidia.  Like Orikes, I'm curious about what non-Nvidia's people are recommending.

For card recommendations, do read the thread titled:       Building/Upgrading a PC for TS2 - Update, 08 September 2006   

Based on the advice given there, I installed the ATI Radeon X850XT card and have been very happy with it.  In fact, that card introduced all sorts of new graphic details I had not seen before in the game. 

I also added a new PSU (power supply unit) to my system to power the card, the new card fan, two DVD drives, and other stuff.

That brings me to a question:  Have those having problems with the nVidia cards checked the wattage of those cards against the wattage of their PSU?  Could it be that the power supply units are lacking in wattage?  Most mfgs will tell you how large a PSU you must have to power a particular card.

Anway, I've been very happy with ATI and would never consider switching brands.

It's not only nVidia cards that go black screen. 

I have an HP Pavilion media pc with dual processor 3.4mhz and x600 ATI graphics and it regularly black screens on me. I have tried everything I can think of and everything suggested above, even playing 800x600 with lowest graphics settings and no sound and it still crashes. As it's intermittent, I keep thinking I've fixed it until the next time it crashes.

My laptop doesn't look so pretty, but has never once crashed.

My Radeon is a 9600.

The NVIDIA that I had to ditch was a 6800, which as I mentioned, was orignally on Maxis' "ok" list when OFB came out.  After the they were flooded with complaints, that and a couple of other NVIDIA's were just one day, no longer on their list (no explanaiton) *snort*

I have an x1900 GT and it plays the Sims beautifully.

Hmmm. I have a friend looking to build a new PC. Maybe I'll talk to him about buying my Nvidia and get myself a Radeon to see how it does.

The funny thing is that the blue/black screen crash/freeze has been happening more since this conversation popped up here. It's like the game *knows*.

Will try the PSU thing.  Otherwise it's looking to me as if EA have cunningly provided us with a game which is unplayable.  Well done them.

I'm inclined to call nVidia the culprit since the game does run very well with current ATI products.

I am running on a laptop with an ATI card. It ran fine for almost a year, then started intermittently slowing down--badly. After a trip to a hot climate, during which I couldn't play at all, the slowdown was so bad, I realized it was a temperature problem. (Duh! It took over six months for me to figure out it was my graphics card causing the problem.) I actually DO deep-freeze it -- when I play TS2, I set it on top of a brick of "blue ice." It works -- no slowdowns while frozen.

I may eventually get a desktop that can handle TS2, but I like to play with my feet up.

Now I would have thought dry ice was a bad thing to put in and around your computer. How does this not damage wires and transistors and things?

Dry ice is merely frozen carbon dioxide.  It sublimes - no liquid state.  In solid form, it's not going to do anything damaging.  In gaseous form, if CO₂ (what I wouldn't give for a subscript right now!) damages computers then we'd all be in big trouble just from having stuff in the atmosphere. 

Sorry, it's the chemistry degree in me coming out!

Don't apologize, Ness. That is just the information I was looking for. :)  That was why I asked. Thank you.

My husband makes such a big deal about dry ice being dangerous to touch and it seems that there are warning signs on the dispenser boxes at the store nowadays. It seemed to me that something "that dangerous" would not be something I would think to save my computer from overheating. Also I was envisioning the tiny wires on the green board getting brittle from being frozen, then perhaps cracking or breaking when the computer was moved off the ice at the end of gameplay.

So please feel free to use your chemistry degree or any other degree you like to tell me why those little wires don't get brittle when they get frozen.

You know, if you feel like it. ;)

Oh, you have subscript available, CO₂

I have a 7600 nvidia GT... which now works.....but only after I added another gb of ram....it would not run correctly with only 1 gb....I would get the dreaded Blue Screen of Death everytime I played....sometimes I would get maybe an hour of play sometimes 5 minutes....I never knew and towards the end it would freeze up as I was saving....and there was nothing I could do but shut my computer down....it was very discouraging cause I had this compute build just to play this game.....now I can...but it took awhile to figure out what was the problem....hope your's get resolved soon....cause I've been in your shoes and it sucks....Tgdrysix

So there is!  I can now CO₂ and H₂O, etc to my heart's content!

With my handy SI data book I can tell you that CO₂ sublimes at -78C, which is -108.4F for you American people, that's why it's so dangerous to touch!

As for what temperatures that low may do to metal wires and their plastic coatings, I really don't know...  presumably it's only going to be a problem if you are trying to move/bend said wires - they may become brittle and break, but things inside a computer are relatively stationary...

How much ram did you add?

 I added another gb of ram....I started off with only 1, now I have 2.  Tgdrysix

Hmmm. The only problem with that for me is I would have to buy 2gb from the getgo. I only have two slots (dual channel) so I've got two 512gb sticks. Upgrading isn't a bad idea, though.

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Hmmm. The only problem with that for me is I would have to buy 2gb from the getgo. I only have two slots (dual channel) so I've got two 512gb sticks. Upgrading isn't a bad idea, though.
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I have 4 slots so I guess techincally I could have up to 4 gbs of ram...but I think that would be a bit excessive... ;)  :).... Having the 2 made a real big difference and I have everything set on high....and I do have alot of cc....so far so good....I'm running sims2, uni, nl, ofb, glamour, and now pets.....Tgdrysix

I don't know if this will help, but we had similar problems with my daughters machine.  Months later, updated the bios and that was the ticket.  Good luck.

Updating the BIOS is about the only thing I haven't tried yet.  Thanks for the tip - I will see if this helps.

I've heard that replacing fans and heat sinks can help with some overheating problems, as can clearing out any built-up dust inside the case with a can of compressed air (it blankets components and acts as an insulator.)

Also, in our just-in-case department, try running the game in windowed mode, bring up the Windows Task Manager and go to the Performance Tab and watch what's happening with your system resources for a while (especially if you're in the habit of running any other programs at the same time.)  It's conceivable some other process could be draining your available memory to the point that it's choking the game.  Before I added more RAM to my machine, FireFox's memory leak would occasionally do that.

One other thing to check is that your power supply is a high enough wattage to handle all the other hardware you've got installed.  I was told when I installed my new high-end video card that it was possible my power supply wouldn't be adequate during heavy usage and it might cause my computer to crash.  (It hasn't, but apparently the possibility does exist.)

My little troublemaker is a Radeon 9550 (thank you, I know it has issues. I deal with them and am saving pennies.)

The old one was a S3G UniChrome....so all people wondering why I put up with the crashing may now stop. Even with base game, the old card never showed the in-game PIPs and special movies. Those little gems were as mysterious as the floating pig.

WTF is an "S3G UniChrome"? Is that even a graphics card? My Linux box made of recycled parts and running in console has a better card than that.

Well, if you want the expensive solution... upgrade to a 7900gt, a 550 watt PSU, and add a gig of ram (2g total).

That's what it took to cure my Nvidia problem after OFB. I had a 6600gt running on a 300 w PSU so it wasn't all Nvidia's fault.

No, do NOT upgrade to a new nvidia card. It is absolutely ridiculous to think you need 2 GB to play this game. I realize that does SEEM to "fix" the problem, but it just camoflages it. The problem is STILL there and who knows if it'll crop up again after another expansion pack?

If you want to escape the nvidia problem.. BUY ATI. I bought only Nvidia for 8 years, until a month ago when I bought an ATI card. It works PERFECTLY with only 1 gb memory.

If you read the thread at MTS2 I linked to, it becomes clear that this IS an nvidia problem, or an Nvidia driver problem, since the old drivers (18 months old) seem to work fine. Unfortunately, if you want to play new games as well as the Sims, or if you have a new card that can't run on old drivers, that doesn't help you.

And bottom line, it doesn't matter if its the Sims that is causing the nvidia problem, or Nvidia that's causing the problem. Nvidia has competition, namely ATI, and the Sims has no competition. If you want to play Sims, and you are having the Nvidia blue screen hourglass fade to sometimes black and turn off your monitor problem, buy an ATI to fix it.

Actually, you do need 2 GBs of RAM to play this game. Most people have a ridiculous amount of CC, and as you should not exceed half the amount of RAM you have in CC, you need more RAM.

No, I'm sorry Pescado, you don't. It's NICE to have 2 gb. But you shouldn't NEED it. And I'm speaking SPECIFICALLY about this goddamned nvidia, blue screen, hourglass, black screen problem. And I'm a bit testy about it.

I've built over 1200 computers. I worked as a computer builder in a retail computer store for 2 years. After than I managed 300 computers for a university library system (with 9 branches) for 3 years.

I'll speak slowly. If.. you .. want .. to .. fix .. the .. specific .. problem .. I am .. speaking about .. Buy .. an .. ATI card. There is currently no guaranteed fix from Nvidia or EA. The 2 GB of memory does seem to mask the problem. But it isn't FIXING the problem. And, Nvidia doesn't seem to give a shit about it. I contacted them 6 weeks ago, and they never have bothered to reply. And we all know EA isn't going to give a shit, since they don't care about their OWN coding.

The ATI problem with Civ IV was worse than the Nvidia problem with the Sims 2.

If I don't see a problem, it's not a problem  :D. I don't care if it's fixed officially or not, my game works. The newer drivers do work with the newer cards.  My card and my driver are about six months old.

I'm up to 4 1/2 gigs of CC, thanks to PMBD :-*. Guess I better buy more RAM, it's easier than deleting all the stuff I hate.

 

It's a built-in excuse for a card that came in my HP Preario. I told you it was crap.  :P

I don't see how a problem that was fixed by an official patch is "worse" than a problem that is getting no serious attention from either EA or from Nvidia. Seems to me that something that has been unfixed for over 6 months is worse than a problem that was quickly fixed by an official patch.

I think its great that the game works great for you now. However, I do have problem with telling someone else that to fix their nvidia problem they should spend EVEN MORE MONEY, on a new nvidia card and then even more on more memory, to fix a problem that's easily fixed by getting an ATI card. I mean, if you are spending all that money anyway, might as well NOT throw it at a company that doesn't care that their game doesn't work with the Sims 2 OFB expansion. Ultimately, yes, its the game company who should be making sure that their game works with the only two video cards out there (for all intents and purposes), however, EA is totally unresponsive to the Sims community. Other games get patches in hours, days, and at most a couple weeks. We wait months for a Sims patch. So that leaves it up to Nvidia. And they don't give a shit either.

And The Sims 2 is supposed to be a "nVidia game" :D

Though I'd just like to say that problems like these are 90% not the fault simply of the videocard, but a combination of things. Like the general state of the OS, video card drivers (the newest is not always the best), god forbid, virii in the system, overheating (those high-end videocards need a damn powerhouse to work correctly), the overall compatibility in computer parts, I could go on. I had overall performance problems before because dustbunnies were piling up in the CPU fan and I was too lazy to vacuum it :P It could have been anything, from CPU to faulty memory or just fragmented system disc.

But this aside, I'd advice finding someone who knows about computers and is willing to look over and diagnose things in the computer. Adding a new shiny hardware can and will problems, and it can freak those people out who don't even know where to begin the troubleshooting. It's always the best to test with other games first (overheating problems are most likely to come after half to one hour of playtime) or just watching a movie on it and seeing how it responds. It's also good to have a diagnostic software handy (Everest has a free version for home PCs). Also, check the power supply, for that kind of card at least 400W should be the minimum and it must be connected separately to the card.

It's hard to say much from the distance, but the solution most of the time is not the change of the hardware. PC configurations these days are so layered and complex that manufacturers simply can't do anything with reports that say "so and so don't work", because the issue is most probably not with the card itself. Also, making the advice to "get another card" won't help that person if s/he runs into the problem again, either with Sims 2 or another game. What, then s/he should get another one until the problem goes away? Personally, to me, the problem seems overheating / not sufficient power supply. And to go against the nVidia-hating a bit, I went through six years without touching my videocard, and it always gave me perfect performance. The only reason I had to change is because it was a "bit" behind on pixelshaders. Both cards are nVidia (GF4Ti4200 and GF6800), both run games flawlessly and glitch-free, including post-OFB Sims 2. Either I got the only non-faulty videocard from nVidia or the problem is not just that easy it might seem first.

WinXP doesn't handle more than 4 GBs of RAM. You'd need 9 GBs of RAM to run that crap. You need to start cutting.

Where'd you hear that from? TS2 is clearly an ATI game.

6 years ago was back during the dominion of NVidia, when Nvidia had the good drivers and cards, and ATI was unreliable and dodgy. Now the tables have turned, apparently.

Gosh - well this is very interesting.  It's not actually resolved the problem, but I've got a few more ideas to play with at least - for which many thanks.

It's definitely Sims2 only that's causing my black screen crisis.  At least based on the programmes I use.  I can play DVDs, point and clicks, and run everything else for as long as needed without any trouble at all.  Highly computer literate husband reckons it's a memory leak problem, which may be so.  I'm most reluctant to cough up any more money for another graphics card, so at the moment I'm just nagging EA to sort it out for me.  To be fair they are trying, but so far without success.  I'm hoping that if I keep bleating at them long enough (along with I'm sure thousands of others), they may feel they have to take steps.  It's not a great hope, but it's a hope.

Yeah, one of them possibly being that people don't read the fine print before purchasing/installing a new video card.  For example, the ATI Radeon X1950 Pro card specs state:  Minimum Power Supply Required:   450 W    Most systems don't come with such a PSU.

Some systems may require adding another card fan to cool a high wattage fan, but you can't know until you read the computer documentation. 

MrsH, if you think you have a memory leak, download and install Cacheman; it has an automatic memory recovery function.  http://www.outertech.com/  There's a free version available.

Ah, thank you!

I'll try it.

If you do a have a fairly literate computer person around, ask them to create a different "Hardware Profile", it's kind of like another user account but more powerful, and you'll need to create a different user too.

Go into the control panel and depending on your view get to "system properties", then choose the "Hardware" button, then choose "Hardware Profiles", choose your current profile and then choose copy, then rename the copy you made to "Games" or whatever, so you can see the difference when you choose it later. Also choose what happens when you start, if you want it to boot the default after 30 secs or to wait for you to make a choice.

After you've done that u should also make a another user account. I've made a new user account called "Simmer".

Now, this is where you need the computer literate person, open "services.msc" and start choosing which services you need for that NEW "hardware profile". Choose a component, right click and choose "properties", choose the "Log on" tab, then in the profile window choose the new profile and then click the "disable" button to stop that service from starting under that profile.

I don't use the internet on my games profile so i turn off most of my network services and my firewall and i only open files that i've downloaded for my games so i turn off my antivirus. I only install things on my default profile under my normal user account. I don't burn CD's with that profile so I disable the Imapi CD thingy. No internet access means the Autoupdate thing won't work so i disable that and the antivirus autoupdate.... so on and so on

And yes, get cacheman. I have 784 (?) megs of memory and cacheman reports i have 485 free on the default profile on my default desktop, but it reports 610 free on the games profile with the "simmer" user, and i have the simmer desktop set at 800x600 so i can tell the difference between the 2 different log on screens.

"CAUTION"!!!! User account changes don't affect hardware profiles, so don't use your default user account on your modified hardware profile or things might not work right when you boot into your default hardware profile with your default user account.

So for me, "Simmer" only logs in on "Games" profile and "Default" only logs in on "Loaded" profile.

There is quite a bit of info around the internet about services that run with windows and which ones are neccesary, so get your helper to look for info if your unsure about something...

Good Luck and PM me if you have questions or need any help  ;D

Greatly helpful, many thanks.  I shall nail him to the floor and get him to give me a hand with this and see how it goes.

apparently there is a big memory leak problem for some people with Pets
http://www.insimenator.net/showthread.php?t=29590