Baby Love and Sibling Rivalry

[nikita]

I'm interested as to know what decides the instant infant relationships in a household once a new Sim is born.  The mother always has the highest relationship with the child (or children in the case of twins) and that is understandable but then what decides why Grandma has a 33/20 STR/LTR with Jr. when Grandpa who was standing right there as well only has a 25/18.  And then why does the older child sometimes get an instant -10/3 relationship with their new sib? 

Is it based on personality?  Proximity to the child?

And in the case of twins, why does everyone in the household seem to favor one twin more than the other in terms of relationship score?

[lindaetterlee]

Actually, I've had a few mothers that pretty much hate their children when they are born.

[nikita]

Well that just adds to the mystery, now doesn't it?

[Myth]

Maybe it has to do with personality points and niceness.  Some people make friends easier than others.

[gali]

According to my observations, when a toddler becomes a child, he always run a "new family member" want - which gives him, if fulfilled, a lot of Aspiration and influence points. And this cause the relation points between the siblings to go  high.

The kid likes to talk to his sibling baby, which can be done only if the parent is holding the baby, and you order the kid "talk to x". When the sibling becomes a toddler - his brother/sister can do it with your order, and he/she likes too to join the toddler in his games. This increases the relationship points too.

But the kid doesn't like to see the parents giving more attention to the sibling - he is jelous, and dislike the sibling at  that moment. So, if one parent reads to the toddler, I occupy the second parent to read to the kid, and this soothes the jelousy. Also, always give attention to the toddler, when the kid isn't around (at school, or playing with another kid).

When there are twins - one of them dislike the sibling, until they become kids; this is quite  a real-life situation, and it can be solved only when the twins become kids.

About the Grand Parents - if they runned a want for a grandson, the relations are very high; it depends too on the astrology sign - if the grandpa is Scorpio, and the baby Libra or Aries, the relation score is low.

I remember once, that Mortimer wanted a grandchild, when Cassie married. When she had a baby girl, I named her Bella, after the grandmother. I couldn't take the little Bella off the hands of Mortie, who liked her 60/45 at first glance, and their astrology signs matched (Cancer and Picses). The relation between little Bella and Cassie were far more lower than the relations between Bella and Mortie.

Bottom line: the astrology sign plays a high role in the first encounter between the baby and the parent/grandfather. Later, the interests become main factor.

As I know, most players restrict themselves to one baby only. But if the player decides to make another baby, he should wait for the "new family member" want of the kid, and only then (after locking the want) - try for another baby.

 

[Annette]

That's very interesting Gali. I have noticed the want a new family member in children but ignored it. If I had waited in real life for my first child to want a sibling we would only have had one child  I can probably fit my sims procreation in around their kids wishes.

[nikita]

Huh, that is interesting.  Thanks for the in-depth explanation.

I'll have to test it out.  I'm mostly interested in sibling rivalry.  I currently have a Sim child who hates his little sister just for her very existence.  It's quite cute to watch him tease her.  I will have to see what happens when both parents shower her with love and kisses and ignore him.

[buddha pest]

I'm interested as to know what decides the instant infant relationships in a household once a new Sim is born.  The mother always has the highest relationship with the child (or children in the case of twins) and that is understandable but then what decides why Grandma has a 33/20 STR/LTR with Jr. when Grandpa who was standing right there as well only has a 25/18.  And then why does the older child sometimes get an instant -10/3 relationship with their new sib? 

Is it based on personality?  Proximity to the child?

And in the case of twins, why does everyone in the household seem to favor one twin more than the other in terms of relationship score?

I think J.M. or somebody once said it's just random.

I'm always a great fan of gali theories though.

[SimulatedDork]

Wow, I thought kids could interact with toddlers? Oh wait they can - it's babie's they can't, unless the parent is holding them.

^ Confirmation? ^

Wow, sibling jealously actually exists? That is so cool, it just goes to show you how indepth Maxis acutally made this game Although it's such a shame that toddlers can't interact: anybody know a good mod/hackothingy that can solve this? Thanks!!

I often find that if the sim witnesses the birth of the baby, the "meet someone new" want is fufilled and the relation ship is boosted compared to those who don't witness the babies birth. Again, any confirmation?

[Ivy]

Toddlers can play and socialize together:  link here for example

I have my twins socialize together this way.  It's fun watching them play together and they get to be friends this way.

No hack or mod needed either


Ivy

[rohina]

Cute. I hardly ever bother with a toybox, but this seems like an argument in favour.

[J. M. Pescado]

Not really. The toybox is completely devoid of any other benefits, largely undermining its usefulness. You're better off doing this over a round of Chess later, where they can also gain logic points while doing it. Plus it doesn't look exceptionally stupid.

[Ivy]

It has other benefits, just not related to skill points...lol.

It fills the toddlers' social and fun needs, brings up their relationships and it leaves one less thing for the parents to have to do, which in my book makes it very useful for multiples.  And I think it's adorable to watch them play.

It's all in how you play and what you enjoy.  I love the toddler stage myself, and I don't push them on skilling like some do.  I let my toddlers be toddlers, including dancing to the radio if they want to...just because I think it's funny to watch. They get their normal skilling toys too of course and if they want a skill point, they get it.  They don't all get smartmilk like it's an endless supply, and I don't play with all the childcare hacks.  Yeah that is probably an unpopular view but that is how I enjoy playing.

For my Legacy Lots, the child chess time is spent playing chess with their future spouse...lol  They have to get an early start deciding who is going to be the next heir/heiress and their mates...got to pass that Legacy on somehow! Fun time with siblings is usually red-hands for fast fun x2 after school and again after homework is done, enough to keep their relationship on track so they aren't annoying each other to death when they have a spare moment.

On my non-Legacy lots, my toddlers often spend months being toddlers.  They grow up when I'm good and ready for them to grow up . 


Ivy

[J. M. Pescado]

It fills the toddlers' social and fun needs, brings up their relationships and it leaves one less thing for the parents to have to do, which in my book makes it very useful for multiples.  And I think it's adorable to watch them play.

The rabbit head also gives +rel. And watching kids play with that stupid toybox is painful because they do it *WRONG*.

On my non-Legacy lots, my toddlers often spend months being toddlers.  They grow up when I'm good and ready for them to grow up . 

I don't think I could tolerate the little screaming rugrats that long. I hate children. Their voices are so annoying and grate on my ears.

[sudaki]

And watching kids play with that stupid toybox is painful because they do it *WRONG*.

Because they aren't beating each other over the head with the plastic horsey?

[J. M. Pescado]

Because they aren't beating each other over the head with the plastic horsey?

No, because the animations for the toys are just randomly chosen and bear no correlation to the actual toy. I've never actually *TRIED* to make two sims use it together, and the only time I've ever even tried the toy box was the Goth house, so I didn't notice that part....but now that you mention it, that *WOULD* be strange, that they don't do battle. I mean, isn't that what even normal kids do?

[nocomment]

What I like about the toy box is when the children make reving car noises when pushing the horse across the floor.  It's weird, funny, and oddly realistic at the same time.

And yes, children do fight a lot.  I'm sure Maxis was afraid to put that realistic touch into the game.

[Ivy]

Urm, how can two toddlers play with the same rabbit head? Whenever I try to get them to interact with the same rabbit head, it gives me the message "there are no actions available."  Using two rabbit heads, they ignore each other, no +rel gained.  The point of the toybox is to get them to get their relationship up with their same-age-group siblings.  I just had my set of triplets on 3 rabbit heads sitting next to each other for 3 solid in-game hours, no +rel gain.  So I don't understand how the rabbit head +rel gain works between one toddler and another?

They play *wrong*? They're just toddlers...lol.  Haven't you observed that toddlers don't care what you hand them, they will do whatever it is that they want with it? Doesn't matter if it's supposed to be used this way or that way, they've got a great sense of imaginary play that makes it whatever they want it to be at that very moment.  Scratch that...I know you hate kids, you probably haven't witnessed that effect.

I'm surprised you don't just bypass the stage and age them up immediately the moment they are born and just give them the skillpoints you want them to have  


Ivy

[J. M. Pescado]

Urm, how can two toddlers play with the same rabbit head? Whenever I try to get them to interact with the same rabbit head, it gives me the message "there are no actions available."  Using two rabbit heads, they ignore each other, no +rel gained.  The point of the toybox is to get them to get their relationship up with their same-age-group siblings.  I just had my set of triplets on 3 rabbit heads sitting next to each other for 3 solid in-game hours, no +rel gain.  So I don't understand how the rabbit head +rel gain works between one toddler and another?

It doesn't. The rabbit head is for rel with older siblings and parents. I don't concern myself with toddler-to-toddler action.

Scratch that...I know you hate kids, you probably haven't witnessed that effect.

No, I can't say I have, as kids tend to soil themselves and scream at the sight of me.

I'm surprised you don't just bypass the stage and age them up immediately the moment they are born and just give them the skillpoints you want them to have  

That would invalidate the achievement of breaking the C-5 barrier. I simply grind my teeth and force myself to tolerate their hideous shriekings so I can make another proper attempt at breaking through that and getting a C-6. It ain't easy, I think I'm really pushing the line of what's possible.

[rohina]

So, when are we getting that toddler fight club hack, then?

[gali]

Scratch that...I know you hate kids, you probably haven't witnessed that effect.

No, I can't say I have, as kids tend to soil themselves and scream at the sight of me. [JMP]

I have a surprise for you, Ivy: once (excuse my short memory) Kewian (or another player) built a house with Pescado, his adult son, and 7 toddlers.
I downloaded that house, and play it a while - WITHOUT cheats....

The main behaviour I noticed was, that each minute JMP was free from action, he rolled a want to play with one of the toddlers, each time different toddler. It was amazing to see the old man showing such an affection for the kids.... He played with them every toy available, cuddled and hugged them, and read to each toddler (he was retired, not working).

I just loved it, but couldn't control all 7 toddlers.

[Ivy]

Well then since the rabbit head doesn't fill toddler to toddler interactions, then it can't be recommended for such things Which was what was originally requested when I brought up the toybox.

I don't blame the kids, honestly...

By the way since typing that last reply, my triplets became best friends with each other due to the toybox.  I cancelled out that silly rabbit thing and sent them to play with their toys and viola, they were ready to be best friends with each other.  How long that actually took in terms of gameplay, I cannot say as I didn't track that.  I do know that since they are currently one of my "aging-off" families my best guess would be "longer than your average toddler time".  But it can be done.

*offers JM some meat from my grocery store instead of a cookie* here ya go, sounds like you're going to need it...lol

Gali, I'm thinking SimJM can handle toddlers a lot better than the real JM


Ivy

[SimulatedDork]

Wow, you people really take things to heart!

Thanks Ivy for the great tip - even if it doesn't build skill points ... and the revving horses are a bit too modern age  // creepy for me. Lol.

Oh and JMP - are you an only child?

[OpiumGirl]

I've actually had children who's want is for a new family member, and when the baby is born, the relationship is in the negative.  That, I just don't understand! lol
I always wondered if the reason tnat children dislike the new baby is sort of like how it is in real life....The child is jealous now that he is no longer the baby.
I dunno, but all the info here is very interesting!

[J. M. Pescado]

Oh and JMP - are you an only child?

Yes. Wasn't that obvious?