couple of problems on business lots: household visiting & manager skilling

[cwykes]

Just started playing again after a break.    I expected and got a random collection of errors, some self inflicted, but I was very unhappy about two things:

1. owner and son went to the business lot by car.  After a couple of days, they phoned home and invited the rest of the household adults over to pass along perks and help out.  They came, but were not controllable (they used to be) and wandered around the lot trying to repair their decaying motives.  They didn't leave!  When the owner closed the business, they were still there.  Father and son got in the car and went home - family stayed on the lot!  I haven't played the home lot yet.  I'm hoping they're all there as if they'd never left which was what used to happen, but I'm worried they'll be dying by the mail box or not there.  Is this a one lot bug or "as intended" in the new world? 

2. Managers can skill with a mirror, but not a book.  If you can control them, you ought to be able to have them learn whatever skill points you want.  Is this a new thing or have I just forgotten?  Why only the mirror?  Is this eaxis or commskilling at work?

I've got a couple of other questions of course! 
3. Should sitting in a car increase comfort? - it didn't.  I think it was the super sports car not a clunker. 
4. Do all objects contribute to enthusiasm in something?  The DJ booths didn't seem to add music enthusiasm.

Since playing last, I've added the K&B stuff pack and FT patch 3, updated to Pescado's latest hacks and added Lordarcy's fixes. Hadn't played a business for a while before that though, so issues could be older.  I had a random collection of errors too and a couple of self-inflicted crashes.  Some of the errors look like attraction problems, several were about "appreciate" paintings, one log mentions the encouragificator and another the phone.  I've attached a subset in case there's anything interesting.

I've never seen a dog interract with a birdcage bird before - I had one outside when a stray came along.  Best moment of the day!

[J. M. Pescado]

Just started playing again after a break.    I expected and got a random collection of errors, some self inflicted, but I was very unhappy about two things:

You forced a bunch of errors, which tells me nothing. Don't do this. We don't care.

1. owner and son went to the business lot by car.  After a couple of days, they phoned home and invited the rest of the household adults over to pass along perks and help out.  They came, but were not controllable (they used to be) and wandered around the lot trying to repair their decaying motives.

Don't do that either, then. I've never tried this, so I have no idea what is supposed to happen.

They didn't leave!  When the owner closed the business, they were still there.  Father and son got in the car and went home - family stayed on the lot!  I haven't played the home lot yet.  I'm hoping they're all there as if they'd never left which was what used to happen, but I'm worried they'll be dying by the mail box or not there.  Is this a one lot bug or "as intended" in the new world?

They'll be fine. State is saved per-lot. You might want to go and delete them by loadlotting the afflicted business lot.

2. Managers can skill with a mirror, but not a book.  If you can control them, you ought to be able to have them learn whatever skill points you want.  Is this a new thing or have I just forgotten?  Why only the mirror?  Is this eaxis or commskilling at work?

Not a clue. It could be a condition unique to CC bookshelves, or perhaps the bar is simply invisible or his skills are maxed. Try a different skill object.

I've got a couple of other questions of course! 
3. Should sitting in a car increase comfort? - it didn't.  I think it was the super sports car not a clunker.

No idea. I pay no attention to the comfort motive most of the time, it is usually self-repairing.

4. Do all objects contribute to enthusiasm in something?  The DJ booths didn't seem to add music enthusiasm.

Some but not all. There is no particular rhyme or reason as to which ones do, don't, and often to what, as these were all added by hand by EAxis.

Since playing last, I've added the K&B stuff pack and FT patch 3, updated to Pescado's latest hacks and added Lordarcy's fixes. Hadn't played a business for a while before that though, so issues could be older.  I had a random collection of errors too and a couple of self-inflicted crashes.  Some of the errors look like attraction problems, several were about "appreciate" paintings, one log mentions the encouragificator and another the phone.  I've attached a subset in case there's anything interesting.

Appreciate has a few bugs in it, yes. I may or may not have released the fix for this. Ask Fat Gwilly People. Where is Fat Gwilly People anyway?

And don't force errors unless specifically told to, the logs are useless without context.

[jsalemi]

I'm beginning to think that FT broke the comfort stuff at some point -- I've noticed that no matter the comfort rating of a chair, a sim's comfort level doesn't rise if they're sitting in the chair sewing.  Same chair by a desk or table and their comfort goes up.  At the sewing machine, it stays static.  Weird.

[professorbutters]

I'm beginning to think that FT broke the comfort stuff at some point -- I've noticed that no matter the comfort rating of a chair, a sim's comfort level doesn't rise if they're sitting in the chair sewing.  Same chair by a desk or table and their comfort goes up.  At the sewing machine, it stays static.  Weird.

Actually, if you sew, this kind of makes sense.  I usually get some back-, finger- and neck-ache when I sew, especially if I'm using a lot of heavy fabric.  Big skirts, corsets, slippy fabric--they're a bitch.

I never pay attention to Comfort and Fun in cars, either, though when I was playing an Asylum, my Sim did seem to get a small increase in Comfort and Fun in the car.  Since then, it seems to me that Sims are *slightly* more Comfortable and have slightly more Fun if they drive themselves in a nice car instead of the carpool.  I don't have FT; I'll be curious to see if installing that breaks it.

PB

[notovny]

 
4. Do all objects contribute to enthusiasm in something?  The DJ booths didn't seem to add music enthusiasm.

Is the DJ Booth you're referring to on a Community Lot? If so, do you have Comm Skilling installed?

Nothing earns enthusiasm on a Community Lot without Comm Skilling. I have it installed, and both Dancing and DJing create enthusiasm in my game,, from both DJ booths.

[Lord Darcy]

1. owner and son went to the business lot by car.  After a couple of days, they phoned home and invited the rest of the household adults over to pass along perks and help out.  They came, but were not controllable (they used to be) and wandered around the lot trying to repair their decaying motives.

To make invited household members to be controllable in owned business, you have to invite household members one by one Ye Olde Way, instead of "Invite Household".

several were about "appreciate" paintings

Did you get errors from OFB awards? In FT, diplomas and OFB awards cause error in "View Many". This issue was already addressed in Pescado's ftminifixes.

[cwykes]

Update on the family - 2 kids were taken by the social worker! 
sitrep - 2 kids taken by social worker and 1 dead adult.  Unsalvageable for stupid complicated reasons.
I picked a subset of the error logs that I thought weren't from the force errors - obviously wrong.  Will try not to do it again.  Sorry Pes.... resists the temptation to post another one about attraction.

1. owner and son went to the business lot by car.  After a couple of days, they phoned home and invited the rest of the household adults over to pass along perks and help out.  They came, but were not controllable (they used to be) and wandered around the lot trying to repair their decaying motives.

To make invited household members to be controllable in owned business, you have to invite household members one by one Ye Olde Way, instead of "Invite Household".

Thanks I don't remember calling them one by one, guess I must have though. I'll do that next time.  It's a good wheeze when it works as the extra adults gain skills, contacts etc. but their motives can decay at the end with no penalty

several were about "appreciate" paintings

Did you get errors from OFB awards? In FT, diplomas and OFB awards cause error in "View Many". This issue was already addressed in Pescado's ftminifixes.

Looked like daisy painting in the error log, but maybe it was an OFB award.

Is the DJ Booth you're referring to on a Community Lot? If so, do you have Comm Skilling installed?

Nothing earns enthusiasm on a Community Lot without Comm Skilling. I have it installed, and both Dancing and DJing create enthusiasm in my game,, from both DJ booths.

I have had commskilling from way back.  If that's adding enthusiasm as well as skilling, I'm out of touch.

I never pay attention to Comfort and Fun in cars, either, though when I was playing an Asylum, my Sim did seem to get a small increase in Comfort and Fun in the car.  Since then, it seems to me that Sims are *slightly* more Comfortable and have slightly more Fun if they drive themselves in a nice car instead of the carpool.  I don't have FT; I'll be curious to see if installing that breaks it.

I wouldn't normally notice either, but this was a starter business lot with no comfort items.  I sent the owner to sit in the car while customers browsed.  Clever move I thought, but it didn't work.

Played another sim yesterday & today as I tried to work out what on earth to do about the adopted kids and dead sim. 
Is there a fix for this one?
5. problem =  gardener truck respawning endlessly. Cause turned out to be a Hobby magazine placed in the road which blocked the car pool.  The car pool then blocked the garden truck which kept re-appearing and spawning more gardeners..  Exceedingly stupid and annoying!

Is this one buggy or am I missing something?
6.  Influence to garden isn't always on the influence pie menu when I think it should be.  A sim with lots of influence points gets the option to influence her friend to garden.  She doesn't take it, but tries again soon after.  The option isn't there.  Some time later, it's come back.  I didn't think anything had changed.

another couple of questions....
7. Why am I getting a party option for New Year in summer?  Alana already had a roof raising New Year party (in winter).
8. Is there anything buggy about gardening badges now?  Alana took ages to earn her bronze badge and soon after she's getting a "talk to plants" option.  Lo and behold she has acquired a gold gardening badge and no messages.  OK I had the speed turned up, but it looked too fast and the lack of messages was suspicious.

[Roux]

7. Why am I getting a party option for New Year in summer?  Alana already had a roof raising New Year party (in winter).

I cannot help with your other issues, but I am getting two "Throw Party" menu options, with "House Party" and "Sports Party" on one, and "New Year's Bash" on the other. I'm about to fire up a clean game to see if it's a hack problem; will report back later.

[Lord Darcy]

I am getting two "Throw Party" menu options, with "House Party" and "Sports Party" on one, and "New Year's Bash" on the other.

Jordi already made a fix for this problem.

Throw Party menu fix for UK English players

Ever since Pets, anyone who has either Holiday Pack or Edition (both the 2005 and 2006) ones, and is playing in UK English (the 24-hour clock), has two "Throw Party" menus on the phones:
One for all standard parties, and one for the "New Year's Bash".

The cause is a typo in the Party Pack override package: EA used the ellipsis character "…" instead of three dots: "...".

Place it into Overrides folder for your latest EP.

[Roux]

I am getting two "Throw Party" menu options, with "House Party" and "Sports Party" on one, and "New Year's Bash" on the other.

Jordi already made a fix for this problem.

Throw Party menu fix for UK English players

Ever since Pets, anyone who has either Holiday Pack or Edition (both the 2005 and 2006) ones, and is playing in UK English (the 24-hour clock), has two "Throw Party" menus on the phones:
One for all standard parties, and one for the "New Year's Bash".

The cause is a typo in the Party Pack override package: EA used the ellipsis character "…" instead of three dots: "...".

Place it into Overrides folder for your latest EP.

Reporting back to say it wasn't a hack conflict and ask for further help... and you already fixed it. Thanks!

That's what I get for ARRing Ikea, I suppose.

Edit: Hmm, this is not working. First, I added the fix to the Overrides folder for FT. When that didn't work, I backed up and replaced it in both the TSS and IKEA Overrides folder, since I ARRed them and they installed as UK. Still didn't work. Went back and replaced in all EPs/SPs back to Pets, and still not working. Tried using Pescado's Engrish to change registry to US... still not working.

One thing I noticed: in FT's Overrides folder, there was originally only one file named Overrides.package. There wasn't a HolidayNewYearsPartyPhoneCall_Override.package. The FT Overrides.package file is significantly larger than any of the previous EPs' HolidayNewYearsPartyPhoneCall_Override.package files. Could Jordi's file just be outdated? Or is there something else I have to do, such as move out families and move them back in? I'm about ready to have done with this and just live with it, but in case there is something I'm missing...

(cwykes, sorry for hijacking the thread...)

[Lord Darcy]

6.  Influence to garden isn't always on the influence pie menu when I think it should be.  A sim with lots of influence points gets the option to influence her friend to garden.  She doesn't take it, but tries again soon after.  The option isn't there.  Some time later, it's come back. 

Influence to Garden option only appears when there IS something unattended in the garden. Seasons harvestables don't count.

7. Why am I getting a party option for New Year in summer?  Alana already had a roof raising New Year party (in winter).

Well, if you live in Australia... Holiday Pack was released before Seasons, in any case.

8. Is there anything buggy about gardening badges now?  Alana took ages to earn her bronze badge and soon after she's getting a "talk to plants" option.  Lo and behold she has acquired a gold gardening badge and no messages.  OK I had the speed turned up, but it looked too fast and the lack of messages was suspicious.

Never experienced something like this. "Talk To" should only appear for Sims with Gold badge in Gardening.

[cwykes]

You're welcome to hijack - I had the two party options as well and I've checked out the fix too!  I hadn't thought about Australia & NZ, but that's a good reason for new year in summer.  Surely you should only be able to have 1 a year though!

Something clearly glitchy went on with the garden badge.  When I looked at her memories, I find I misread the message I got in game - she got a gold badge straight off, without ever having a bronze or silver.     Lets assume it was a 'cwykes type problem' rather than something more. She was a sim from base game I hadn't played in a long time.

New problem/question
8.  Borked Food - I have a whole raft of borked food in inventories and fridges and sales display units including some that I'm pretty sure was freshly made on home and cooking hobby lots.  I have dontshoot food and it's the latest version....... from March.    Has anything come up about borked food since FT?  Is there anything special about food made for cooking contests?  I assumed it was just 'normal' serving plates in the inventory, but I'm pretty sure I couldn't serve some of those plates.

All three families I've been playing have visited the cooking hobby lot if that's relevant.  They are also old base game/OFB problems including the Jaquets and their bakery.  They had rafts of borked food in displays and inventories after cooking at home before FT and at home and on the cooking hobby lot.  They had so much borked food that I quit without saving!

PS Lord Darcy - thanks for all your item fixes.  I've DlL'd the job lot - fyi downloading ikea fixes before you install the ikea stuff pack causes a crash.  I had two before I twigged. 

[J. M. Pescado]

I'm beginning to think that FT broke the comfort stuff at some point -- I've noticed that no matter the comfort rating of a chair, a sim's comfort level doesn't rise if they're sitting in the chair sewing.  Same chair by a desk or table and their comfort goes up.  At the sewing machine, it stays static.  Weird.

The craftbenches drain comfort heavily, so the chair is probably only slowing it down.

[Lord Darcy]

8.  Borked Food - I have a whole raft of borked food in inventories and fridges and sales display units including some that I'm pretty sure was freshly made on home and cooking hobby lots.  I have dontshoot food and it's the latest version....... from March.

It seems that dontshootfood doesn't protect food stored in food displays. It only protects food stored in Sim's inventory, and not all of them. After I install a new EP/patch, I find that some of them were shot to hell anyway.

fyi downloading ikea fixes before you install the ikea stuff pack causes a crash.  I had two before I twigged. 

Thanks for the heads up. I'll warn people not to download the fix before they install IKEA pack.

[cwykes]

I'm beginning to think that FT broke the comfort stuff at some point -- I've noticed that no matter the comfort rating of a chair, a sim's comfort level doesn't rise if they're sitting in the chair sewing.  Same chair by a desk or table and their comfort goes up.  At the sewing machine, it stays static.  Weird.

The craftbenches drain comfort heavily, so the chair is probably only slowing it down.

As long as the chair is actually doing something!  Maybe we just expected it to do more.  I have also felt that there's a bigger motve drain on the FT craft benches than I remember there used to be with OFB craft benches.  I played OFB pretty intensively, but of course my memory & observation skills are going/gone.  Perhaps it's just that I usually had snapdragons around OFB craft benches.

It seems that dontshootfood doesn't protect food stored in food displays. It only protects food stored in Sim's inventory, and not all of them. After I install a new EP/patch, I find that some of them were shot to hell anyway.

In that case I have to change my playing style.  Continuing to keep food in the inventory is obviously just stupid and running food shops is asking for trouble.  GRRRR.  I suppose after the last EP/SP when the game is finally stable, I could go back to doing both.   

Two more questions and another annoyance....
9. I've had 2 fortune sims on different lots roll wants to get promoted without rolling wants for the missing skills.  That never used to happen.  Has something changed or is it just me?  I wonder if FT assumes that they'll have the Lifetime awards to get promoted without them.

10. My sims aren't rolling badge wants when I'd expect them to.  Used to be, you fished and got a want for a bronze.  Then when you had the bronze, the silver want would roll.  I'm hardly seeing any badge wants and silver is not rolling when bronze has been obtained.  Anyone else noticing this or is it 'a cwykes type problem'?  I confess that I've updated Pes's hacks, but not the others, though nothing looks relevant.  I wondered if it was this WFSanity at work - haven't caught up on all the hack threads.

11.  I send an elderly sim to the dresser to put on his outerwear so he doesn't go out in the garden in the snow in his underwear.  He gets to the door and changes back into underwear!  He looks like a candidate for a care home pratting about in the snow in his underwear.  I guess nounneeded coats is deciding it's not cold enough for a coat and changing him back to what he was wearing before.  Wrong answer in this case.  Maybe I should go find the hack thread later and see if that's been discussed - would be nice if it ignored sims already in their outerwear.

[Roux]

9. I've had 2 fortune sims on different lots roll wants to get promoted without rolling wants for the missing skills.  That never used to happen.  Has something changed or is it just me?  I wonder if FT assumes that they'll have the Lifetime awards to get promoted without them.

10. My sims aren't rolling badge wants when I'd expect them to.  Used to be, you fished and got a want for a bronze.  Then when you had the bronze, the silver want would roll.  I'm hardly seeing any badge wants and silver is not rolling when bronze has been obtained.  Anyone else noticing this or is it 'a cwykes type problem'?  I confess that I've updated Pes's hacks, but not the others, though nothing looks relevant.  I wondered if it was this WFSanity at work - haven't caught up on all the hack threads.

I've also seen both of those happening since FT, although some sims still roll the old way. I'm not sure why. It might be because once they get hobby enthusiasm in anything, they start rolling lots of hobby-related wants, which tend to crowd out other, more important wants.

Alas, Pescado has said that hobby-related wants can't be stomped with wfsanity because they lack a check tree (or something like that... I don't really speak Awesome).

[Lord Darcy]

It seems that dontshootfood doesn't protect food stored in food displays. It only protects food stored in Sim's inventory, and not all of them. After I install a new EP/patch, I find that some of them were shot to hell anyway.

In that case I have to change my playing style.  Continuing to keep food in the inventory is obviously just stupid and running food shops is asking for trouble.  GRRRR.  I suppose after the last EP/SP when the game is finally stable, I could go back to doing both.   

Most food stored in inventory is safe though. It's only small handful that got ruined. I don't notice them until Sims take out ruined food via Macro/Eat once in a while.

10. My sims aren't rolling badge wants when I'd expect them to.  Used to be, you fished and got a want for a bronze.  Then when you had the bronze, the silver want would roll.  I'm hardly seeing any badge wants and silver is not rolling when bronze has been obtained.  Anyone else noticing this or is it 'a cwykes type problem'?

The badge wants seem to have gone a bit screwy, yes, but it's a quite inconsistent problem. Sometimes I can get the next level badge wants just fine, other times they're stomped by other stupid wants. Fishing badge wants don't come up as often as pre-FT.

[leaths]

Since this thread has already been slightly derailed, I'm going to go ahead and ask about something I've been noticing lately. My teenage sims consistently roll the makeout want before they roll the want for their first kiss. Has anyone else noticed this or are my sims just fast?

[J. M. Pescado]

Since this thread has already been slightly derailed, I'm going to go ahead and ask about something I've been noticing lately. My teenage sims consistently roll the makeout want before they roll the want for their first kiss. Has anyone else noticed this or are my sims just fast?

This is a normal EAxis-inflicted glitch in the game. The regular "Kiss" want and "Make Out" are both triggered by "Flirt", but Kiss is locked out unless First Kiss has been achieved, whereas Make Out is not.

[leaths]

Well, it figures that the answer is typical EAxis programming stupidity. I thought that it had started happening with FT, but it must have been my imagination.