More bullshit from Massive Shithead

[J. M. Pescado]

I'm telling you, the answer is mandatory rocket launcher ownership.

[Hobbsee]

Sheesh.

No, my job as a cashier is *not* to take shit from you.  It's to sell you stuff.  It's to return your stuff, assuming it follows policy.  Anything else gets a manager, and they have to deal with it.  If you're abusive enough, i'll call the emergency call, and have you thrown out of the store.  I don't get to make decisions about stock, and I don't care sufficiently about you to break the rules, where I could lose my job for it.

Cashiers are trained on dealing with angry customers, and can also invoke the Supreme Right To Refuse Service.  I hope we never lose this!

With my consumer hat on, though, i can't see why anyone buys the games from actual shops, when they're barely at beta-test status.  But I wouldn't bother to take it out on someone who can't do a thing.  I'd also suggest writing an email to corporate (of the shop)- that does way more than a screaming rant.  Assuming you don't lie, and exaggerate the problem, of course.

[J. M. Pescado]

The only messages I have found that corporate ever pays attention to come attached to rockets. Again, this is why countries with mandatory rocket launcher ownership don't have customer service issues. Like the definition of "corporation" goes, "an ingenious device for generating individual profit without individual responsibility". In countries with mandatory rocket launcher ownership, this sense of responsibility can be provided by an angry mob armed with rocket launchers at the gate. Lobby your local politician for MANDATORY ROCKET LAUNCHER OWNERSHIP today...preferrably with a rocket launcher, because that's all they ever listen to.

[TaWanda]

So where can I get me one of them thar rocket launcher thangamabobs? I've decided you just might be right, if we launch enough of em at stupid, belligerent customers, we won't have a customer service problem here anymore either.

[MutantBunny]

Oh ye of little minds, those that think in paper sacks....lol. Exactly the reaction I expected from clerkwhiners.

'You obviously never worked as a clerk...' blah blah. Wrong. I worked through college selling various items, became a full time droogie (manager.)  And this is where I learned about the comsumer laws. (and I worked with the public all my life--even as liaison with the government.)

You wanna know what the name of the law is? YOU go hunt it up. I know it's there, don't give a rat's ass if you want to be ignorant and remain stupid/believe me or not....

How does my throwing a fit at a clerk hurt the corp? THINK. If I take the clerk's I can't help you quietly and go on my way: THAT helps the corp. If I scream and throw a fit THAT disrupts the workday, it makes the other customers present take heed of the state of the product, the return policies of the store or simply uneasy. All good for the irrate customer. Just because the customer behind me doesn't say "I think that person was right and you should do more to help them" or something along those lines doesn't mean they aren't thinking it. There are people that side with the irrate customer at least one for one for every one that is agreeing with/kissing the clerks ass for some reason.

It is NOT my job to track when the manager is in or out. I am not going to spend my gas and my time waiting for the manager to see me. (I also am not going to spend any more of my money at a store with stupid unhelpful policies/clerks/managers.) I also know that many many times the manager has simply said "I'm going in the office/leave me alone for a while/tell whoever wants me I'm out." If it's the store policy that only a manager can help with returns, then a manager should be onsite and available ALWAYS. That's what assistant managers were made for.

So you little minded clerkwhiners get a look at the reality of the situation, not just how it affects YOUR day (and screw the customer and their day). Screw you--it's your job. Don't like it? Find a new job.

I also stated once already, second and last time here: I do not go in yelling and insulting. I do not cuss etc. I start my 'act', because that is what it is and it does work, when I am treated badly, condensendingly, insultingly, as if I were stupid, told over and over again about the 'policy.' Anyway, most of the time, repeating the consumer laws alone brings the manager out of hiding and tada: problem solved. But if I am driven to a scream, then I scream.

I'm with JM. A rocket launcher or flame thrower would straighten a clerk-whiner/stupid store polic/greedy corp right out.

[nil]

... I'd also suggest writing an email to corporate (of the shop)- that does way more than a screaming rant.  Assuming you don't lie, and exaggerate the problem, of course.

lol, if that can normally work well in most cases, customers wouldn't have to be forced to blacklist the shop or store.
You know, there're too many junk mails in a given email account, and a CCS person can just "happen" not to check "junk mails", so it wasn't CCS person's fault not to have received your honest and polite email.

So, good lucks...

[Solestri]

I also recommend the use of rocket launchers, so they can be used against people like MutantBunny.

[Ryslin]

I used to deal with people like Mutant Bunny for a living. It was my desk that the whiners, the folk who swore no one handled the complaint correctly, the folk threatening legal action , these were my bread and butter.

I enjoyed first explaining in no uncertain terms that the contract states thus,you signed that contract. (ISP) I have gone over your case and either..

Yes your complaint has some merit, let me try this fix.
No, your complaint has no merit, this is a fault of an entity that is out of our hands. (usually the telco) No screaming at them will not aid you and often will hurt you. My job "sir/ma'm" is to speak to that entity on your behalf. The legal contract does not allow me to have you talk to them directly. I do apologize ..yadda

The minute the word legal action is mentioned we were told to hang up. I usually gave a warning. "If you threaten legal action the only response I have is to direct you to our legal department. At that point it is no longer a matter of getting it fixed but a court issue and will be handled by lawyers accordingly. (Boy did they hush up)

My father loves to pull the "this is my problem , give me an answer or I get irate" game. This is the same man who if he yells at me for how I fix his computer I walk out.

I don't care what the "corp" did to piss you off. I am sure some other "corp" did it to me as well. Even , and often in the process of helping the very screaming customer that is so upset at me.
Making someone else's day hell just to feel like you have done something gets you no where. You talk to me civil, and I will give you straight facts (often to the consternation of the "quality listeners" on my calls). If you do not like the facts you are free to take your money and leave. (Though often that entailed a 100 dollar early termination fee)

My method when I get screwed by a corporation. I make friendly with whatever rep I am able to net. I ask them precise questions and give them an understanding that I am looking for answers. If they can provide me with the next step in the chain fine. If they balk I wait.
Screaming makes one look like a tard.

[TaWanda]

Exactly the reaction I expected from clerkwhiners.

Mgt/clerkwhiner thank you very much.

I also stated once already, second and last time here: I do not go in yelling and insulting. I do not cuss etc. I start my 'act', because that is what it is and it does work, when I am treated badly, condensendingly, insultingly, as if I were stupid, told over and over again about the 'policy.' Anyway, most of the time, repeating the consumer laws alone brings the manager out of hiding and tada: problem solved. But if I am driven to a scream, then I scream.

So...when you were a mgt/clerkwhiner just how many corporate policies did you effectively change because some irate customer made you his/her target for the day? How about as a customer, have you seen any actual changes in policy that you think you can attribute to masses of people having meltdowns in a store?

Sorry, when I witness a scene like you are talking about I might step back and have second thoughts about the store if I see that the employees are behaving badly, or seem to be poorly trained, but how does watching a customer behave like an asshole reflect badly on the store? All that does, is make me think that said customer has the maturity and communication skills of a two year old.

[morriganrant]

I also recommend the use of rocket launchers, so they can be used against people like MutantBunny.

Indeed, then I wouldn't have to bother with calling the cops until after the damage is done. I don't know about ya'll but I didn't really get any training, my manager just threw me out of the floor with some basic instructions, the same with the register. I was in no way trained to deal with customers, I had basic policy covered with a booklet. We can call the manager if he's not there if an extreme situation comes up but the peons, meaning the clerks other then sub-managers don't have the number. The manager is th only one who can access most of the options in the damn computer, the rest of it is automatic for him and us. He just assumed that I was intelligent enough to not screw up, which was fine with me, it however has not worked with some of the other part-time help that we have. Gamestop part time are in no way trained for too much of anything, atleast not in the areas that I know. If you throw a fit at me, I will throw your ass out, if you are civil and act like and adult and not a spoiled brat I will do the best I can for you. Here is the thing that people seem to be missing, it's only the damn manager who can make these type of decisions and even he can't sometimes. If the situation comes up that we can't handle then we will tell you when he will be back, when you could call when he's there or we could call him if we even have the number, he will either yay or nay it then we can tell you that he will take care of you tomorrow. Repeating customer laws at me at my job is going to do nothing but have me tell you when the manager would be back or give you a way to contact a head office.
Clerks can take in all returns other then opened computer games except when there is something wrong with the disk or opened new games except when there is something wrong with the little clasp inside so that the game didn't stay in place.
Assistant managers can make a few exceptions, like if the receipt is a  little past the alloted return date but if this is the third time your console doesn't work then I still can't give you a full refund, we can get you a new system but no you can't just say "fuck it, give me my money back."
I don't care how much you freakin yell at me, If I say we can't then we can't. Yes policy is repeated because we can't do what ever it is and doing so looses me my job, but no-one cares about that. You don't like it? Shop somewhere else.

[MutantBunny]

".... I make friendly with whatever rep I am able to net. I ask them precise questions and give them an understanding that I am looking for answers. If they can provide me with the next step in the chain fine.... "

LOL!  Who says I don't do that too? Do I need to say it yet again?? Well, I won't.

[notovny]

You wanna know what the name of the law is? YOU go hunt it up. I know it's there, don't give a rat's ass if you want to be ignorant and remain stupid/believe me or not....

Hey, you're the one who made the claim that there was a Federal Law that allows return of any non-abused purchased item with receipt. Burden of proof's on you. If there is one, I'd like to know about it. Has any employee or manager  you've pulled this on asked you  which law you were referring to?

I do find it a bit odd that the State of Michigan's District Attorney's Office seems to disagree with you on this point, however.

Edit: TinyURL link to the same page: http://tinyurl.com/22cujb
Edit^2:  Added "non-absused" caveat.

[morriganrant]

I do find it a bit odd that the State of Michigan's District Attorney's Office seems to disagree with you on this point, however.

You may want to try again, that link is not working at all for me.

[Tigerlilley]

Sorry, back on topic:
It doesn't bother me what MaxSam says these days.  I made my decision to never buy Sims products until SecuRom is taken off, and I'm sticking with it.  TSS was the first pack I have fully pirated with no intention of buying later.  I hope a lot more people are sticking to their word about pirating only. 

[Doc Doofus]

WHAT WORKS:

Here it is.  You are getting advice from The Master.  When my family has problems like this, they come to me, because I have a fucking black belt in the art of Clerk-Jitsu.

The key word is PERSISTENCE.  That's it.  The more time you talk on the phone to them, the more employees, low level or high, that you tie up in explanations, the more annoying you are without crossing the line into being rude or abusive, that is money from their bottom line.  And if you play the game nicely and politely, you can do it for YEARS. 

The question is, is it worth it to you to invest your time in a crusade?  Because if your time is too valuable, you probably lose.  If, however, you are so devoted to your cause that you will cheerfully cast away countless hours of your free time calling and visiting a store, there is a HIGH likelihood that at some point somebody at the store will say, "Aw, fuck it, just give him what he wants.  We have work to do.  Jesus."

This is why overt abusiveness, rudeness, legal threats, are all counter-productive.  They give the company an excuse to just cut you off from the complaint process.  From the point of view of a large corporation (and this will vary from corp to corp (that Canberra government office being a good example), their complaint policy is designed to say no until you just give up and go away, angry or happy, whatever.  The prospect that you JUST MIGHT have more time to play the game than they do throws a monkey wrench into this strategy.  That is why you must exude confidence and cheerfulness at each twist and turn, as if you're going to enjoy fucking with them.

The idea of going to the manager is a very good one, but it's only part of the process.  Each time you call, if you can get a lower level employee and drag him through the whole complaint process from beginning to end, before being shunted back to a manager (hopefully one who hasn't hung up on you before), you have cost them money.  An hourly worker (how much do clerks get these days?) talking on the phone to the same customer, repeatedly, about the same problem is an avoidable expense.

At some point, you will exhaust their patience and they will become abusive to you.  Hooray!  Be slightly shocked and offended.  Make sure that everybody knows that you know their name and job title.  Collect this information politely, early in every discussion, so it doesn't sound legally threatening.  They will remember this.  You are now armed to go to a higher up at the corporate level with not just a complaint about some lousy cheap shit-ass product.  You can now ask why you were hung up on or yelled at by the employees at the Lakewood Mall franchise when you were only trying to return a defective product.  Mention the name of the manager.  DO NOT get angry or openly seek vengeance.  Sound bewildered but professional. 

You are ready to play the same game at corporate level.  And, oh yeah, don't give up with the lower level employees, too.  Call them up to see if they have spoken to Mr. Big Doohickey at corporate about the discussion you had with him about the product. 

Eventually you will wear out the patience of Mr. Big Doohickey at corporate.  That's fine.  He has a boss, too.  You didn't try to hasten the process by going straight to his boss, did you?  No?  Good.  This is slow torture.  No water-boarding here.  Just thousands of paper cuts.

Again, at some point, Mr. Big Doohickey refers you to Mr. Bigger Whatzit.  This is a rather intimidating prospect for him, because now he's wasting his boss's time on a shitty $29.99 CD.  Hopefully, Mr. Bigger has more important things to do.  At this level, being rude is extremely counterproductive.  Waste this man's time.  Give this man the longest fucking possible explanation of your problem that you can muster.  Take your time.  Get confused and start over.  Put him on hold for a minute to take a call.  If you can do this from work, perhaps your hold system will play Muzak for him.  Stranger's in the Night, I hope.  Tell him you'll get back to him to finish your story, then do the same thing over again.

But before you get back to him, go back to square one and call the other low level employees, clerks, franchise managers, and tell them the progress of your adventure, that you have actually talked to Mr. Bigger and that he wants your problem resolved, and ask them if they have heard from him yet.  If they have not, tell them that it is imperative that they contact Mr. Bigger at once to find out how your problem is being resolved.

If worse comes to worse, and you get blown off by people too big to get past, just wait a few weeks and then start all over again, as if you have amnesia and can't remember what went wrong the first time.

There are more things you can do to fuck with their minds.  I mentioned the putting them on hold thing.  Another one is taking names and job titles.  Be very polite when doing that.  If they ask you why you want that, say it's because you may need to call them back and don't want to have to waste another employee's time starting all over again.  After they tell you their name and title, pause for a second and type it on a keyboard so that they can faintly hear a quiet clickety-clack in the background.  The implicit suggestion is that you are logging everything for some purpose, possibly not a benign one.

Also, when speaking to management people, when they start to tell you about their customer policy, ask them to fax a copy to you.  Ask them to explain it to you, not as if you are just one customer with a complaint, but as if you might have an agenda beyond just getting your refund.  Perhaps you are a journalist, or an attorney, or somebody from corp. testing them.  Who knows?  If they ask you what your job is, tell them that you are "a private consultant."  Remember: POLITE, CHEERFUL. 

Okay, so you read all this and you said, shit, I can't do that!  It would drive me nuts before it drives them nuts!  Well, tough shit.  I'm telling you what works.  If you don't have the brass balls, well, just eat your defective product.  This isn't for wimps.  This is for borderline psychopaths who enjoy fucking with people.  I'm laughing my ass off writing this.  I wish I had some corporation to fuck with right now. 

I do this regularly with Congressmen.  It's not good enough to just call your congressman.  You need to call everybody who works for him, everybody in his caucus.  You need to show up at his office when he's there and act as if you already had an appointment.  You want to do everything you can short of getting a restraining order filed against you.

[neriana]

Doc Doofus, that's hilarious! Believe me, at my store you would have succeeded much more quickly, as soon as you got to me, if I with my lowly assistant managerish power could have helped you. Whenever anyone was polite and reasonable, I would do what I could. Most people really are polite and reasonable, so it mostly works out. Then there are people who are spoiled and rude -- no matter what these people think, clerks can't produce games out of thin air, are not expected to have played every game in the store, do not feel nothing when one customer threatens to kill another over a place in line, are not responsible for bugs in a game, are not responsible for company policy, and are paid to help customers and sell product, not to be slaves.

[starrling]

The only messages I have found that corporate ever pays attention to come attached to rockets. Again, this is why countries with mandatory rocket launcher ownership don't have customer service issues. Like the definition of "corporation" goes, "an ingenious device for generating individual profit without individual responsibility". In countries with mandatory rocket launcher ownership, this sense of responsibility can be provided by an angry mob armed with rocket launchers at the gate. Lobby your local politician for MANDATORY ROCKET LAUNCHER OWNERSHIP today...preferrably with a rocket launcher, because that's all they ever listen to.

Hey, Pescado.  How's it feel on the wall there?  Yanno, the wall...as in wallflower...where no one pays attention.  Seriously, how many times did you have to post that?  ROFFFFLY.   

And MutantBunny, I'll bet you were one of those bitchy people shopping on Black Friday in the store where I work.  You know the kind of bitchy people I mean?  Those that think they're the only people that are important on the face of the earth.  Come on, doesn't that have a familiar feel to it?  Admit it.  I know you wanna. 

Sheesh.  Everyone should work retail for one holiday season.  I think there'd be a lot of nicer shoppers in the world after that.

[squish]

I don't know about ya'll but I didn't really get any training, my manager just threw me out of the floor with some basic instructions, the same with the register. I was in no way trained to deal with customers, I had basic policy covered with a booklet.

Same with me. I was given two hours, tops, with register training, and that was just the basic sales stuff. I was then chucked out onto the floor after a tour and pretty much left to figure things out on my own. That bit made me laugh though, because there were two touch screen do-it-yourself photo printing machines and customers were always "I don't know how to uuuuuuuuuse it, it's soooooooo hard" despite the fact there's a voice over prompt that explains what to do as you go through it. The very first time I used it, was when helping a customer on my first day of the job and I managed to help them without knowing what I was doing, by reading the instructions on screen and listening to the voice prompt. 

Apparently because you work in a department store you're not only supposed to know about your own deparment, but know about other departments too. I was employed, as was everyone else, to work in a particular deparment (mine being entertainment). Many times I had people come up to me (while I was woking in my department, either being behind the counter, or putting things away) asking me to help them in gardening or with chemicals for outdoors toilets. I hadn't even heard of such thing as chemicals for outdoor toilets, let alone know anything about them! Telling these people that I can call someone from the appopriate department to come and help them wasn't good enough though, one lady telling me I need to "go home and get an education". Uh, why? Because I don't know anything about a department that I don't work in? Riiiiiiiight. They bitch the employee isn't trained with what they want, but then bitch when the employee offers to find someone who CAN help them *head desk* And the problem with training employees is finding time to do it. I was the only person working in my department, and if I was off the floor getting trained, then someone else would have to be pulled from another department to cover me while I'm gone, and when you live in a town where all businesses are short staffed (most people go and work for labouring jobs, earning a couple thousand a week, but someone has to do the little jobs, or there'll be no stores to shop in), there aren't enough people to go around as is, let alone trying to find people to cover another's shift. I was just given some  book that had a list of products and some basic info in it, which of course doesn't help when the customer wants to know more fiddly things about a TV or whatever and my manger never knew if I called and asked him either, and he'd tell me to "look in the book". This book was also outdated and didn't have a lot of things in it, either. Lack of knowledge isn't the empoloyees fault - it's the corp's and managements faults for not offering decent training.

[veilchen]

The one thing I always hated was people who brought their kids and then paid no attention to them whatsoever. They were left running wild, and then the employees were actually expected to produce the kid post-haste after they were done shopping. Of course, the kids were in 7th heaven and proceeded to tear the store apart.

I only worked retail part-time in the evenings after school to pay the bills, but boy, that was quite exhausting.

[witch]

Enjoyed your wee dissertation on fucking the corporate mind, Doc Doofus. A friend of mine took a similar tack when she started a letter writing campaign with her local council. Given that the council numbered their letters to her, she also numbered her letters to them, the first one was 000000001.

[spaceface]

Everyone should work retail for one holiday season.  I think there'd be a lot of nicer shoppers in the world after that.

I second that, but would like to add that everyone should work an office job, the kind where you type things and answer the phones. Two weeks should be enough.

My college jobs were retail/data capture/receptionist/theatre usher/you name it. As a result, I tend to be fairly tolerant of service staff everywhere, because I know what they are supposed to be doing I guess. (The only exception to this rule is the Teenage Zombie Sales Staff. I am not tolerant of them, as they make no effort.)

Any idea how rude people get to the person who answers the phone: "Why is Mr X on his lunch break? Blah blah why isn't he available ALL THE TIME to talk to me?" Srsly.

Also, as I am an attorney at a small law firm,  I sometimes answer the phone at work after hours (usually I am the only one working late).  Men call me "honey" and assume that I am a secretary when they hear a female voice. I do not waste my breath on them.

[LizzyJ]

Also, as I am an attorney at a small law firm,  I sometimes answer the phone at work after hours (usually I am the only one working late).  Men call me "honey" and assume that I am a secretary when they hear a female voice. I do not waste my breath on them.

That happens to me at work also. Builders. I have a few that refuse to deal with me because I'm a female, but once something fucks up or their delivery is late, they expect me to fix it.
I worked retail for two years while I was doing a traineeship. Absolute Hell. Worked in every department and got abused in every department. One woman let her little angel shit on the floor and didn't bother to tell anyone.

[phyllis_p]

I worked at Wal-Mart as a cashier one holiday season a few years ago. Wal-Mart has fairly rigorous training compared to what I'm hearing about a lot of other stores.  We were required to watch training videos on a computer and then take tests on the different modules.  I forget what score you had to get -- 70% or 80%, I think -- but you had to keep doing it until you got it right.  I think it took me a week at 4 hours per day to finish them all.  Then we were with an experienced cashier for 3 days.  Then -- on our own.  My first day at the register alone was Black Friday -- a real experience 

If ever a customer approached us asking for help -- whether we were on break, leaving to go home, whatever -- we were expected to help.  We were expected to know where everything in the store was (including groceries -- it was a super-store) even if we didn't know anything about particular products, and were expected to find or summon someone from that department to assist before we left.  Actually, we were also supposed to greet any customer who walked within 10 feet of us. I think some of the wokers slacked on that one, but I always tried to give a smile and a nod even if I didn't speak.

I got tempermental customers at the cash register sometimes -- usually folks I had to ID for buying various things.  The worst was a young guy buying an R-rated movie DVD.  We had to check IDs to make sure they were 17.  He didn't have an ID and got quite irate with me because he said he was 21 and I wouldn't sell the item to him.  I told him, sorry, but if I sell it to you and you're under age, I lose my job.  Also used to piss people off about ID for cigarettes, but we were supposed to card on cigarettes up to age 28. And then there were the poor little kids who'd come through trying to buy white-out.  Couldn't sell that and certain other potential "inhalents" to minors. They just looked sad, scared, and embarrassed, though -- they didn't mouth off.

[Zazazu]

My first day at the register alone was Black Friday -- a real experience 

Dang, that would be awful. I worked at Sears for 2  years during high school, more hours during the summer. My last pre-college summer I worked at a factory in the inventory department starting at 6 am - 3pm, then drove about an hour to Sears and worked the evening to close. I never worked Black Friday, but I did work Christmas Eve twice, and I had the busiest, most easily seen register in the women's area: lingerie. That being said, I rarely had anyone get irate with me about anything in my department. I'd have people come over with shoes and get pissed that I wouldn't ring them up, but most were understanding after I explained why they had to be done in the shoe department. The worst two were both returns of items...one that wasn't ours and I ended up pulling a JCP catalog and showing them that the brand was carried by them, the other of a supposedly only-worn-once shaper that was stained gray from all the exposure to cigarette smoke, had a couple of tears and suspicious brown stains. That was the only one that I had to call security on to have them removed from the store, because she was screaming and insisting that it was new and defective. I rarely called a manager over, actually only if the customer requested it, as I was kind of an unofficial floor manager when my immediate report wasn't in (that'd be usually).

As annoying as it can be to have people treat me like a child due to my rather childlike voice, it really is a blessing when dealing with people who are angry. It takes a special breed of asshole to yell at someone who sounds incredibly sweet and innocent.

[Jelenedra]

I've worked retail, but thankfully, at Blockbuster. Not so many shoppers on Black Friday, but the week BEFORE Thanksgiving? GOD. Everyone came in to rent things for the kids to watch while the adults cooked/watched football. So, by the time Thanksgiving rolled around and people were thinking of this last minute would bitch about everything being gone. Especially video games, Christ on a Crutch. I dunno how many times I heard, "Where are all the games?"

"Everyone had the exact same idea as you, only they got here days ago. Have fun with the 4 year old Madden game. It's all we have left."